Look, the moment when Carlton asks Don who he’s dressed as is beautiful. I get it. Symbolism. Woo. But it’s a total anachronism. Parents didn’t take kids as old as Sally and Bobby trick-or-treating in 1963. That’s very modern, that’s what you call “helicopter parenting.”
Believe me, as late as 1971, when I was 10 and Roberta was 6 (more or less the same ages as Sally and Bobby), I was taking her trick-or-treating without parental supervision. I was going door-to-door selling Girl Scout cookies at that age. All by myself. A very protective parent might say “stay on the block” in those days. Or not. But accompany the kids? Are you kidding?
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126 Responses to “Trick-or-Treat Anachronism”
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anachronism: a chronological misplacing of persons, events, objects, or customs in regard to each other
Betty and Don walking up to the front door of Francine's home, keeping in mind that Francine and Betty are neighbors and friends, as their nine-year-old and six-year-old trick-or-treat is not an anachronism. Just because Deborah's parents wouldn't have done that when Deborah was a child does not mean no one did it in 1963.
Taking an infant out, making trick-or-treating a family outing in 1963 or in any year is not an anachronism. . . because people do it. It is not a chronological misplacement.
People in MadMen forums all over the internet keep confusing their own memories and knowledge with universal truth. When it comes to human culture, there are no universal truths.
There are some facts, such as the first year IBM selectric typewriters were actually sold, that are incontrovertible. .. but when it comes to the varieties in human behavior, there are few things that were absolutely true or absolutely false in 1963 . . or in any year, past, present or future. Human behavior has infinite permutations.
In 1984, when my daughter was two years old, her father and I took her out trick or treating on our one block. We did it mostly to be neighborly but also to openly adore our baby, dressed as a clown, in front of other humans which, I believe, is a universal human behavior replicated in all years and eras.
For someone like Betty, who we are told cares very much about appearances, showing that her family is in tact, showing her new baby. . . these things matter to her. I remind folks that Don offered to let Betty stay home with the baby, or he offered to stay with the baby.
I think Betty went out, and took the baby, for lots of reasons, not the least reason being a signal related to the big show down she and Don had the night before. Also, keep in mind, the writers like to build in ambiguity: one of the great aspects of this show is how each detail can be seen ambiguously, with myriad layers of meaning, myriad contexts. Was Betty, by going out with her family, signaling to the neighbors that her family is intact? Some of them must have known Don was gone for a few weeks (when he went to CA). . . mostly I think she was sending signals to Don, that she is sticking with their family .. at least for now, that she will continue her Doll's House life. . . for the time being.
I loved the intimacy revealed when she shared her food with him. That is a very intimate gesture. How would offer a half eaten hot dog to anyone but a spouse or child?
When Betty and Don appeared on the doorstep directly behind their kids I sorta startled–I would hardly have noticed them if they were dressed casually, Betty had the baby on her shoulder and they were standing on the sidewalk.
Which is why Carlton's comment was so apt–they did look as if they were in costume and presenting themselves just as their kids were. Carlton's reaction would have been just as apt if he'd blurted out WTF (speaking of anachronisms).
So maybe that's one of the points Weiner is making–Betty and Don really have no idea what they're doing and it is really obvious. They're trying to be "normal" but present a tableau that is entirely out of place.
I would argue that they would have seemed just as out of place at any time in the history of trick or treating.
Not that anyone cares this far down in the thread: I was born in 1955. When we lived in a subdivision of a smallish city and knew everyone's name for blocks and blocks, dads came with the kids (and stayed on the street). Moms handed out candy.
Then we moved to the Hollywood Hills, in the '60's. So, by the time I was ten, I trick or treated by myself all over the neighborhood. (Which had a lot of apartment buildings, so maximum coverage with little effort.) I can't imagine what my parents were thinking, to let me out alone at night.
And this was AFTER I was molested on my walk home from school one day in that neighborhood. (Nothing life changing or tragic, but nevertheless disturbing.)
But, I was also allowed to wander about by myself on Saturdays into major shopping districts, taking the bus, going to movies, from the age of 10 on. My mother had done that growing up in NYC and couldn't see the harm.
Now, she would probably be arrested for neglect. A different world.
I grew up too far out in the country to go Trick or Treating–except for the one time we visited the trailer park up the lane. So I have few personal memories. It does appear that parents sometimes came along, even "back then."
And I agree that the last scene was a bit "composed." Betty, coming along with the baby to make a family portrait. Don, coming home late (because of work, this time) & not having time to get into casual clothes. Possible symbolic meaning for the kids' costumes–although they were common, easy home made themes. (Red Skelton's Freddy the Freeloader was a famous TV hobo.) The occasional reminder that the show is art rather than reality does not disturb me. I'm against spousal abuse, but was glad to see the slightly cartoonish clocking of Greg.
One small historical note: The news story that rocked the country & really rang the alarms about Halloween Poison Candy happened in my neck of the woods. A little boy died after eating cyanide-laced Pixie Sticks. As the story unfolded, it appeared his father had given him the candy, after taking out a very big insurance policy. A dreadful story that really had nothing to do with candy from strangers–but it cast a pall over the holiday. Snopes details here (warning–there's Jack Chick!): http://www.snopes.com/horrors/poison/halloween.as…
The FSM would be a cool Halloween costume if it could be done right (al dente?).
Unaware of all its dogma, was that sacrilegious or blasphemy in the eyes of the FSM? Do I need to look out for the righteous wrath of noodly appendages?
If so I humbly prostrate and apologize for the apostasy.
Shiraz can work with pasta if the sauce is red.
Too me, the anachronism, if any, would be Carlton's fishing into a bowl of little candies or what not to give the children. I remember getting only standard size candy bars (1 each), homemade goodies (popcorn balls, yum!), fruit, or pennies. When did the mini candy bars first come out, anyway?
#99 — You are correct regarding the common law derivation of statutory limited liability company laws in the United States. References are made to such entities being formed in Germany, France and Latin America before the United States joined in. ( and <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_liability_company )
With regard to the New York (1994) provision: Part of its legislative history (i.e., the reasoning and legislative intent behind the new law) states that "…limited liability companies represent a new form of business enterprise…first appearing in Wyoming in 1977…."(NYS Governor's Program Bill Memorandum #234).
It would be interesting to somehow determine how many L.L.C.'s existed in New York State around 1963.
Not an anachronism at all – Don and Betty are not 'helicopter parenting' – they're just in the process of digesting the biggest ever shock to their shaky marriage – one that they might hope could actually improve things. (Don's actually in worse trouble than before, isn't he?).
So would they sit at home and earnestly discuss it while the kids they suspect they neglect wander Ossining at night? Or would they act out? – Don, in his (however temporary) submissive state, allowing the newly empowered Betty, with her three-month old baby btw, to lead him round the neighborhood in a parade of togetherness. Keeping up appearances, literally.
The neighbor's question to Don is both a weak joke and an ironic comment on how it's not usual to see parents out in that way. So unusual behaviour, but no anachronism.
Unaware of all its dogma, was that sacrilegious or blasphemy in the eyes of the FSM? Do I need to look out for the righteous wrath of noodly appendages?
you need to celebrate the holiday called "holiday."
I am lapsed because I did not observe "talk like a pirate day. " arrrrgh!
it is a positive faith that hopes you are touched by his noodly appendage. that's a good thing.
esme, you know. . . (this is way off topic)
If I were not an androgenous cyber-identity spontaneously generated by the new Dunder-Mifflin Paper Company website which became self-aware at midnight on 08/09/09 due to power flux anomaly,
I might get down on my virtual knee and ask you to **111001010100 1000101 000100100011110** {code syntax error} reboot required 00101111010FAIL0010
There's a deep sense of geek regard on this thread.
Can you feel it?
esme and less of me, you may need to find a remote corner of the blogosphere and … you know … replicate for a while. With or without the red sauce.
I shall turn my back. Better still, log the hell out.
Anne B – I know, I know. I'm surfing around, working on it.
I found a Star Trek: The Next Generation RulzForever site just off the SuperHighway at Exit 723.
It has a tawdry little vacancy at The Hologram Inn.
Of course a REAL geek would have made sure that read "The Holodeck Inn."
Apologies to the fanbase all around.
Back on a Mad Men topic–
Did anyone mention how knock-out cute Sally looks in that photo up above?
And did anyone notice it looks like see put a little beauty mark on her cheek?
And don't we all remember Don plucked a little grading star from sweet Suzanne cheek a while back.
No doubt who the gypsy represents now, I guess.
log out? vhat es dis ting? (actually, I have been off line… off "playing" online… all day. don't I get some points for good behavior?)
fwiw, one of the "blessings" of the pastafarians is to say "may you be touched by his noodly appendage."
maybe you've never seen that masterpiece of kitsch by designer Niklas Jansson illustrating just this moment.
I have no idea if less of me is male or female, or rather I didn't till I just learned that l-o-m is an androgynous cyber identity who works in Scranton.
I'm, unfortunately, not geek enough… Here. Come sit in the kitchen. I have something to tell you. I have never actually celebrated talk like a pirate day. Okay, I said it. Yes of course it's true I have said a few "arrrrghs" here and there. But… I just loved the Kansas board of education thing. really. that's all it was.
(clutching my pearls and running to my room)
A sophisticated eye for truth in art, mon cheri.
Fret not mon amour, I have tied enough "scurvy dawgs ta th' yardarm" for the both of us, it is of no concern to me. I will not-so- tenderly school you in the pirately ways of pillagin'.
I now fear the low rentrendezvous will beneath us.
Perhaps a suite at the MicroSoft Astoria instead?
(They make a delicious salad; no walnuts though, the secret is bacon bytes).
Until we type again, Je vis d'amour et d'eau fraîche.
you are too funny.
I have to give the round to you. ding. ding. ding. you win. I have no snappy come back and I have to be sans computer for a while.
so I'll have to leave you with Nina Simone's Pirate Jenny.
Me likes the links, esme, don't stop.
I'm just trying to match your funny; I'm kinda competitive. ARRRRR-RR-GGH!
Shiver me timbers or some rot.
Jack back into Matrix when you can!
I remember an episode of "Bewitched" a show about an advertising man and his family which takes place in the '60s, anyway on this particular episode, Samantha and Darrin did go trick or treating with Tabatha. I further recall that all the children out that night had adults with them. Me, I'm the same age as baby Gene and I don't remember going with my folks but I do remember my older sisters had to go with me and my younger sister and brother.
i was 9 in 1965 – some parents came with, some didn't, sometimes it was one parent while the other stayed home. same as it is now – there isn't a set standard rule for parents and their kids on trick or treating.
This isn't anachronism … I think it's based on the story and the fact that Don and Betty and the family unit are sort of reuniting.
My dad took my older siblings trick-or-treating well into jr high, especially since an adult tried to steal their candy from them one year. I think we were allowed to go out by ourselves in high school.
Totally agree. I think my mom accompanied my brothers and I till the eldest was about 9-10, then, we were on our own!
I absolutely HATED my mother the year she had the termerity to go on a date and leave us with a horrid babysitter, Mrs. Mitchell.
To add salt to the wound, Mrs. Mitchell made us come in from trick or treating at 8:30 p.m. Gasp! ;O)
Didn't Bobby specifically ASK Don to come trick-or-treating with them in the very beginning of the episode? Perhaps the original plan was for Betty to accompany the children and for Don to stay home, but then he changed his mind to make the children happy. Reasonable enough, and I don't think it would have raised any eyebrows.
Sally and Bobby are only 8 and 6 years old here; I don't think that an adult accompanying children of that age while they're out on the streets after dark would have been completely unheard of at any point in time. (Even if there was less of a panic about child abduction, there was still the very real risk of a kid being distracted, not looking before crossing the street, and being hit by a car–even more likely at night when there's less visibility.) Perhaps most mothers did not accompany their children trick-or-treating in 1963, but some surely did. Most parents of that generation spanked their children, but there were some that did not. There's no real universal in human behavior.
I was born in 1958, in Queens NY. In the 60's, we would go t-or-t'ing all over town without parents. They never were with us in my entire Halloween experience, we were always safe. When I watched that scene I was like "huh? why are Don and Betty going with the kids and why isn't someone home to hand out that candy corn?"