Oct 182009
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379 Responses to “Open Thread: The Color Blue”
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So, I logged in to fix a broken link in the main post (and have fixed it). And I saw the title of the post-show post… and resisted the temptation to read it.
That is all.
Well, that and I might have to stop at Brooks Bros. tomorrow for a Janie Bryant special.
Good Evening, Ladies and Gentlemen! What's the dish tonight? Am I Blue? I Am Two!
Is there a public place in NYC where people watch? I'm crashing at a place with no AMC.
Rich (and this is tragic; believe me, I feel your pain–it happened when we went to LA), I can't promise anyone will be watching, but the Phoenix Park, where we had our little shindig last year, has a back room with TVs and a waitress who is a fan. My understanding is that she is still there as of a few weeks ago and there have been a few small gatherings. 206 E 67th between 2nd and 3rd.
Blue on "Mad Men" is the color of new. Since Peggy represents the younger generation, I'm pretty sure she's going to win the account. It is going to be fun to watch Paul and Peggy compete for the account, whichever account it is. Can you imagine the humiliation Paul's going to face if he looses to a girl?!
How about 'Big Blue' IBM?
Rich,
Try this?
But if anyone else has recommendations for Rich, it would be greatly appreciated!
At least I'm consistent ; )
But yeah, if there are ACTUAL gatherings, let's hear of 'em.
So I had a sudden hankering to hear this.
Hah!
I have a DM into a trusted source in NYC, but he seems to be away from teh Twitter at just the wrong moment.
1963 IBM AD – http://tinyurl.com/yhx4bmy
IBM 360 was debuted in April '64 http://www.computermuseum.li/Testpage/IBM-360-196…
Slightly OT: I'm impatiently awaiting 9:00 pm — watching the History Channel '24 hours after' (Kennedy Assassination).
As I've mentioned before, I'm a native of Dallas and used to walk the Plaza/GrassyKnoll route after lunch almost everyday. Years later my best friend worked as a trauma/ER nurse at Parkland. All these images are so familiar to me. kinda spooky seeing them in black and white.
C'mon 9:00 ! 🙂
Kenny Burrell's album Midnight Blue topped the jazz charts in 1963. And Jasper Johns' Red, Yellow Blue made its debut.
I'm watching Downhill Racer waiting for MM to come on. Fashions changed enormously in just a few years although you can wear a lot of the clothes now.
I'm getting in touch with my inner Betty Draper tonight. I have a friend who's a huge "Mad Men" fan coming to my apartment to watch. The menu isn't period or anything, but I'm excited for the show.
Hey RetroGirl,
I think it's cool people get together to watch the show. For me, it's one of the few chances of "me" time I get. heehee.
Almost time to grab a cold brew. yea~
Sigh…it SO sucks that there's no 7pm showing on the west coast…
Something fun to read while we're waiting the fill the next 15 minutes, from Lance Mannion:
http://lancemannion.typepad.com/lance_mannion/200…
I'm going for Big Blue IBM Farnham. IBM was mentioned in Season 1 – the guy on the train (from the Army days – Ft. Sill) who recognized Dick Witman worked for IBM.
# 15 SallyB – I drive by the knoll every weekday heading home from downtown – and by the storm drain that still has the chip out of it where the last shot came from…
Watching the Phillies pummel the Dodgers waiting for the opening scenes of MM. ;-(
Matt Maul has been talking about the colors used this season a lot in his reviews so it's interesting to see an ep called "The Color Blue"…at the end of the season I'll be interested to hear Matt Weiner's thoughts on why he did this.
I secured an invite for Rich, but not to a public place, unfortunately.
@ #21
Oooooh. IBM would certainly be interesting, if only because Larry Krysinski(?) — the guy who served in basic training with Dick Whitman — works there.
This is not the first time this season I was forced to endure the last two minutes of Top Gun waiting for Mad Men to start
Really, Jules. That movie seems to be on every other week. Nice song though at the end.
High Five to # 23 Farnham 🙂
3 minutes! Brew in hand…bring it on!
See you all on the flip side! Gotta pay attention now. Happy watching…
DON'T DROP THE BRIEFCASE!
Too late.
Kater!
Someone sent me this quote, and it made me think of Bert Cooper:
There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.
Wait, Connie's office is calling there? How is Don pulling that one off?
Don left his mistress's phone number with his service! My mistress hates when I do that. It cuts into my her time
Blue is in the eye of the beholder
His service called Miss Farrell's? Would his assistant now know her number?
I would have said the color blue is refracted at a spectrum of 440–490 nm
"Sigh…it SO sucks that there’s no 7pm showing on the west coast…" There is a 7 pm showing if you have HD cable. 🙂
I think they're really overdoing it with Don's five o'clock shadow.
Warren!
He's eating date nut bread.
Anyone know what $5k would be equivalent to today?
Allison is the perfect secretary. I love it!
Paul….chill out dude! ha.
Will Paul bring his gee-tar to the Western Union pitch?
I love it! Mrs Pyrce thinks Hooker's a toad, too!
I like the snake in basket on the windowsill.
Moneypenny left the office as if Pryce was royalty!
She calls Moneypenny a toad, and then describes her husband's innate toadyness
"I've been here ten months and nobody's ever asked me where I went to school."
Love it.
uh ohs…
a $2.25 tour of Harlem?
"I've been here 2 months and no one's ever asked me where I went to school." Classic Pryce
Now Don is meeting her family? Oh dear.
epilepsy
"He's arrogant. His plans were interrupted." I'd say he knows Don pretty well. Very perceptive man!
Is this like Love, Actually with Laura Linney and her brother?
This is definitely going to be one of those episodes I'll need to watch five times to get all of.
Alex P,
$5,000 in 1963 is $35,289.05 today.
ooo and she's still reading it at the table… fantastic motif
Let the bunny boiling begin!
Poor Sally! She can't even answer the phone the right way.
Someone slap Betty please. grrrr~
BELCH
He's gonna forget that key in his pocket ~
Don will leave the desk keys in his bathrobe for Betty (mabye Carla) to find
Paul is drunkedy drunk drunk.
in 22 minutes there are 72 comments?? oh, this is going to be a good one when the west coast finally catches up.
Great, now we get the Paul Kinsey happy dance.
Ms. Farrell is turning into Fatal Attraction.
must be late fall given the color of the leaves
Possessive…
Uh oh. I'm getting creepy vibes from Farrell now.
Something about the cinematography in that scene in the train car was phenomenal. May have been the golden glow from outside the window and the light and shadows and colors from the trees in the background.
If I were Betty and found that drawer full of hidden cash — I'd blow like Krakatoa. Then I'd go spend it…all in one day. you betcha.
Are trains still symbolizing escape for Don? Hmmm…
i don't get what's up with the brother. why can't he work? why was don scared of him? what's with the bandage? someone help me please!
Alex P (81)
It's all the more remarkable for being green screen work.
That is definitely early/mid October foliage in the Hudson Valley out the train window. But was the stop Philipse Manor…I could not tell.
Gail Collins' new book "How Everything Changed" is filled with great info about the women's movement in the early '60s. Recommend it for anyone who didn't live through the era, or wasn't old enough to be aware of how much has changed for women since 1960. Very entertaining social history, as you'd expect for the author.
Betty is finally going to get inside that desk! Also, the comments about Ms. Farrell maybe being unhinged aren't so far-fetched.
jane,
The brother has "fits," likely epilepsy.
Betty found the key! Yes!
Lois?
Lois!
LOIS!
omg!! Lois the driver is still there!
What??? Lois STILL HAS A JOB???
#78 It's not Halloween yet.
Lois is still employed?
thank you karl!!
Lois!
Wait, she still has a job?!
"Very rousing, sir" Hooker
"Churchill rousing, or Hitler?" Pryce
Gasp…SC for sale!
WHAT? SC is for sale??
Oh god, those Brits are ice cold business men.
that clench-jawed James Masonite – lol. eeuuuwwww.
S-C for sale.
Poor Paul, of course he still has Lois.
I knew it. The Brits are out, finally!
Sterling Cooper is for sale!!! LBO!!! Quick, who has cash?
Oh man, I didn't even entertain the possibility that Henry Francis called. Brilliant. I need to rewatch and see BOTH Don and Betty's reactions now.
Nice call on the key everyone. That didn't take long.
OH MY GOD. NO WAY.
Holy excrement, Batman!
He kept the Whitman keepsakes
oooooo Shit- meet- fan
"Just you wait. All hell's going to break loose."
Mother of GOD. She found the Dick Whitman Box.
Oh My…and hear you guys all had me thinking she'd only discover the MONEY. This is much more revelation-y.
DUCK AND COVER!
Jane, epilepsy, if untreated, can lead to brain damage. It is possible that is what has happened with Suzanne's brother.
OMG. BETTY OPENED THE BOX.
um why did don leave ALL of everything he'd ever want to hide neatly placed in the locked front drawer? too obvious, don. please.
I forgot all about Anna giving him a divorce.
HOLY CRAP. THE TRUTH IS REVEALED…
She's got the drawer open… OH. MY. GOD.
He needed one of those executive bank accounts from season 1, with safe deposit box
I definitely screamed "Holy shit!" at the top of my lungs. I think I scared the dog.
*hear=here I was so shocked I mixed up my homophones.
Holy crap! I knew it would happen but I didn't think he kept all that info!! OMG!
this is a game changer. Betty has the upper hand now. How will she play it?
Why in the world did he not keep that stuff in a Safety Deposit Box?
Blue BathrobeGate!!
Typical. The one thing that Betty fixes on as discovering the "truth" is the one thing in the box (the divorce) that isn't true.
Oh this is going to be the confrontation to end all confrontations…
Oh it's going to be delicious. Finally! After three years of this…
Suzanne must really be getting to him if he let THAT happen . . . .
I think Betty will keep this a secret for now.
He was just looking at the photos a few episodes ago, so we knew the Whitman stuff was there.
Car crash?
Bedford, Mass, is just west of Boston — 3 hours one way?
Wonder how long he'll stay in Massachusetts.
189 miles from Ossining, NY to Bedford, MA
If the younger brother is 25, then Suzanne's at least 27, which was fairly old to be single in those days, especially for a teacher who clearly loves kids. Wonder what happened in her past?
he's trying to make up for Adam
This has guilt over Adam written all over it…
He is making up for Adam. (Wow and they're already near Framingham? Long drive home.)
I hope Betty doesn't chicken out.
NE people: Where is Framingham in regards to Ossining and Boston?
Framingham is close to Boston.
Framingham is about 25 miles from Bedford
Close your eyes, Betty.
nicely done with Betty.
Aw crap. Betty, you wuss.
I can't believe Betty was going to confront him…I would need some serious time to think! I'm glad she chilled out for a second.
Framingham is right near Natick. Hope that helps!
Framingham is west of Boston. Ossining is on the Hudson River. You would drive north and cut over somewhere.
While we're at commercial – when Sally hung up the phone and was wondering who called, Betty told her to stop thinking it's all about her. Just like when Don was talking about signing the contract in 723.
Genius Hitchcock moment, making us think he was going into his own house where Betty was waiting to confront him…and instead he walks into Fatal Attraction's flat.
Framingham is west of Boston. Ossining is on the Hudson River. You would drive north and cut over somewhere.Were 87 and the Mass Pike open then?
speaking of great advertising. Am Express's was amazing. products that you can buy take on human features of happiness. with amazing cello. bach concerto?
I'm still stuck on the pep talk scene w cooper. Was he trying to convince him to buy the firm back?
ok, enough already on framingham
#152 — Mass Pike (Rt 90) was open but Don appeared to be on a dirt road. Weird.
#153 Bach prelude to the first suite in G for cello
Wow, Betty almost blew a gasket.
thank you, Dahlhalla. I knew there were amazing music people here.
"I want to show you off, Bets." "Okay." Dammit, why does it have to be the 60s? Poor Betty. Even tho she's a bitch I feel for her.
Framingham, Framingham, Framingham
Paul's bottle is his "Person from Porlock"
"What's wrong? WHAT'S WRONG?"
Eeep.
Jan, those early GPS systems were really unreliable.
"I want to show you off." A truly piggish remark in light of Don's behavior.
I saw Kinsey the other day walk by in Union Square. He looked a little overwhelmed . . .
lol. I love Betty's reaction. Her entire world has changed and Don is clueless.
OH Peggy.
THAT WAS BRILLIANT.
Roger's mom?
Crazy.
Roger's mom. Hahah
Peggy has that Don mojo with this ad stuff. She just pulled that out of thin air according to the inspiration of the last five minutes. I wonder if that's what Paul thought when he stared at her in shock. That he can't even get mad about her outdoing him anymore, because she's too far beyond his abilities.
But I may be theorizing too much. Anyway, yay, awkward party time – not much time for it until the show ends, though.
Roger's mom is even funnier than Bert Cooper!
"They" moved the Waldorf-Astoria to construct the Empire State Building on the site
oh I love this stuff with the various arrivals.
"Does Mona know?" Bwah!
Mother Sterling! And she's batty.
Pryce doesn't want to go back.
Is Betty going to reveal Don on his big night in front of everyone?
Was Cooper just thinking about where he'll be in 40 years?
Roger can hardly stand it. Neither can Betty.
Whoa.
What a glare.
# # 177 Melville Says:
Pryce doesn’t want to go back.
I got that vibe too!
AWE. SOME.
oh, that was wonderful.
i think i just got a chill…
Mother of Pearl…I'm watching the replay
What. An. Episode. It was actually more shocking than someone getting their foot run over by a lawn mower.
Roger can hardly stand it. Neither can Betty. Fade to black.
Next episode preview: Joan appearance, Betty packing her bags? Can't wait!
Betty is taking the kids to California.
Is it possible that Joan's coming back? Please?
Umm…. wow.
I think I've figured out who the ex-client is for next week's episode…
remember the remark Pryce made about not being asked what school he went to while in the US? I agree, he'd rather stay.
He also thinks Moneypenny's a toad, hee hee.
OK…right on…an episode that had OFFICE as the main focus, but then Betty opens the box as well.
I'm feeling rather satisfied at the moment.
Well, this time Betty really can't just sweep it under the carpet. I wonder if she'll just take off and leave everyone behind, that would be a nice twist. That look at Don at the end said it all…she saw a phony.
This was Betty's best moment since last season when she called Don out on his cheating and probably up there with when she told the psychiatrist she knew her husband was unfaithful to her.
But why did she put back the keys??!
I really liked Don empathizing with Kinsey's plight. A very human side of Don that clearly shocked Paul. But then he had his mind blown by an amazing talented Peggy.
still waiting for it to be 10 in Seattle, but loving that Rich came here to find a place to watch in NYC
"You're spontaneous, you're a girl, and you use Aquanet." Missed that the 1st time.
Peggy still hasn't gotten over Don tearing into her a few weeks ago. "Are you nuts? He hates me."
ok…questions.
Was Betty more taken aback by Don's divorce from Anna or finding out hes really someone named Dick Whitman? or did she find out about the latter?
I felt when she came across Don's photos of him back in the day… I assumed his the name 'Dick' was written in the back. So why didn't she closely examine the photos? She seemed like she wasn't really surprised from the photos but mostly surprised about the divorce certificate.
Also, was it just me or did the shot of Joan looked as if shes now a therapist analyzing Betty or something?
If thats the case, I think Joan would make an excellent therapist since she liked to guide and analyze everyone at Sterling Cooper…especially Peggy.
okay, Greg H – who do you think it is?
(btw, I think Betty is going to her brother's for Thanksgiving and that's why we saw the bag. She mentions it at the beginning of this episode.
Wonder if Sterling and Joan are going to do some dictation.
I can't stand it–who WAS that playing Mother Sterling? She looked so familiar!
I THOUGHT that Rich was Rich Sommer. (I get his feed on Twitter and it said the same thing.)
Now I just need Jon Hamm on here to ask the same question. I am in NJ but only 5 miles from the GWB! LOLOL.
Pamela, Betty also found the deed to Anna's house; she knows Don bought a house for someone in California, the state that issued the divorce. AND she has those pictures. And two sets of dogtags.
@ Pamela #206
Was Betty more taken aback by Don’s divorce from Anna or finding out hes really someone named Dick Whitman? or did she find out about the latter?
I don't think she understood who or what the photos were, or who the people in them were. The only thing that made an impact were the divorce papers. Perfect irony, since that's the only thing in the box that isn't true.
There was a deed in the box, too. I wonder if it's for the farm and that is where Betty will go next week.
I keep thinking that Lane may actually help the Americans…since he keeps getting tossed around by those Brits — I love their language, however: "coming over on the Pond" "need all the flowers in the vase" … fabulous!! I think Paul is no longer jealous of Peggy- but actually in awe of her now….
Betty finds the Dick Whitman Sampler Box. Surprise!
Does Mona Know? LOL
Peggy was very gracious as she left Paul with egg on his face.
Pryce is worried he'll be dispatched to India or worse.
Who is the woman in the picture that Roger holds up to Bert and says "remember her?" like she was a babe?
brenda, the address on the deed is in Long Beach, CA – Anna's house.
There was a deed in the box, too. I wonder if it's for the farm and that is where Betty will go next week.
Jeff, was it Celeste Holm?
Wow! What an ending. I think we have been set up to witness the opening credits fall.
Found this blog tonight, and am jumping to the end. Now watching the encore performance.
OMG, I can't believe Betty didn't even TOUCH the money – that would have been the first thing I would have looked at, at least just to see how much was there. I can't believe what a careless dork Don has been. I can not believe Betty didn't light into Don right away – she has more self control than me.
I think tonight is my favorite episode so far – loved Mrs. Pryce; "He's such a toad!" ROFL
Totally love Roger – always. Roger's my fave. And Paul totally needed a chill pill. And I loved Peggy burping into the microphone. Why didn't she back up and erase it???!!!
Kater Gordon is impressive.
Thanks Debbie…looking at my question, I could have re-read it…I rushed over here from watching the episode, heh. I'll closely examine the episode again since it's saved in my DVR.
Do you think Betty did the right thing by putting the stuff away? I felt like she should have at least kept the key. I think she put everything back for a good reason, and I can't wait for it!
AND WHAT WAS PAUL DOING BEHIND HIS DESK
Thanks, Abby.
# 211 Deborah Lipp Says:
"…..Betty also found the deed to Anna’s house; she knows Don bought a house for someone in California, "
She HAD to have written the address down, doncha think?
@220
Embeth Daviditz is Mrs. Pryce. She is incredible in the movie, Junebug.
Wow, wonderful episode. And even though I was so upset at Don and Miss Farrell, I now get it. It's Dick that's fallen for her, not Don. They share a fatherless childhoods and having to take care of a younger brother. And what's with the comment about 'long curly hair' he made to Suzanne? Was that a reference to Midge or someone else?
Also, want to point out that Peggy kept the Hermes scarf…at least it looks like the scarf. She was all kinds of awesome this week. Love when Peggy turns on her 'Don-ness'.
Finally, although I've been going back and forth over Betty and leaning towards annoyance with her, I genuinely felt bad for her when she opened that box. The last three episodes are going to be so goood!!
I wonder if Peggy's belch was unscripted? Maybe Elisabeth Moss just burped in the middle of the scene, ad-libbed in character ("Sorry, Olive"), and they just left it in because it was so funny and real.
Did you think the picture that Roger showed Bert was of Celeste Holm? And if so, why?
How in the hell is Lois still employed?
OMG Paul at his desk. LOL
Hey everyone, this is my first post here, though I've been lurking for some time.
Wizzy: My immediate thought on why Peggy didn't erase the burp is a thumbing of the nose at Olive, who was so worried about Peggy when she was smoking marijuana that one Saturday with the boys. Peggy seemed to take a beat or so to consider it before apologizing.
Roger's my favorite, too! I hated to see him marry Jane, ugh.
#230….I was thinking the same thing!!!!!!!! WTF
Amer. Inst. of Econ. Research says $5k (1963) is now $34,926.47.
Lois would have been fired. It's stupid.
Roberta and I were discussing that people who lived through the Depression had a tendency to mistrust banks, so money in the drawer wouldn't be so weird.
yeah, how can Sal get fired and Lois still works there????
Outstanding episode! I need to watch a few more times before having anything worthwhile to post… however – props (as always) to Janie Bryant – I think Pryce's wife's pearls were BLUE … the detail is extraordinary.
– the "new" Bobby this season looks like a young Dick Whitman – I'm sure Betty noticed the resemblence when she OPENED. THE. BOX.
– Since everyone at SC seems defeated and depressed this season – my guess would be that Don, Roger and Bert will buy SC back – thereby bonding them forever and letting them have autonomy again.
– to echo other posts… good to see Lois, but was surprised she wasn't fired!
– I'm missing Joan something awful…
What an amazing episode! It had the perfect balance of office life and home life. Peggy and Paul were both stumped on what to do. Peggy even gave Paul partial credit for the idea. (I'm paraphrasing) "What were just saying about the faintest ink." Paul was blown away. I don't think he had realized how good Peggy was at her job. He's facing serious competition from a woman, who's a decade younger than he is. He's entered his own personal Twilight Zone.
Betty found the box. Holy Shnikes. She saw everything. The deed is to Anna's house in California that Don visited. The line in the episode guide for next's week episode about Betty taking a trip just got a lot more interesting. She knew she needed the time to process everything, so she sent the kids away. Betty is realizing he isn't the man she thought she married. I can't wait to see what happens when she confronts him.
WTF-Sterling Cooper is being sold again. I can't believe it.
Don saw Miss Farrell's brother as a second chance with Adam. He wanted to do the right thing.
I'm so excited for next week!
London calling to the faraway towns
Now that war is declared-and battle come down
London calling to the underworld
Come out of the cupboard, all you boys and girls
Roger Stearling beautiful fake speech. Our hero is at its zenith of success. Its a tragedy of mythological proportions. Pandoras box has been opened, Icarus few to close to the sun! An utterly fake life with a real wife who is about to go rouge, caught in a company for sale he is now contractually obliged to stay with, add in a fatal attraction mistresses and public disclosure of all of this will not sit well with his father figure; Papa Conrad
@ 240 Jules- I thought the exact same thing when I heard the phrase "London Calling."
When I saw all of the money in the drawer this episode, my first thought was, Don is such a child of the depression.
Had to add – I loved Betty's painful call to Henry! I tend to have sympathy for Betty. People seem to keep holding her up to the standards of today.
Favorite line: Bert: "If I had intended for it to be a secret I would have never told Roger" and "Who told you I was vain..?"
Did you all see Betty's smile when the key fit!!?? LOL
God, I love Jared Harris's performance as Pryce! I hope they figure out some way to keep him on if PPL sells the company.
"An antiepileptic drug known as tiagabine has been shown to reduce color vision in about 41 percent of those taking the drug, although effects do not appear to be permanent." (Tiagabine was discovered in 1988, but somehow there is a connection between epilepsy and color blindness). AND "Blue-yellow color blindness can be observed only very rarely. Different studies diverge a lot in the numbers but as a rule of thumb you could say one out of 10,000 persons is affected at most."
Genius, Jules. Joe Strummer is smiling.
As for the money, Betty has been around it all her life. And she probably has her own little stash of freak-you money somewhere in case she needs it. Every woman should.
I'm really not getting how Lois is still there… I mean I'm glad to see her and all but no way.
Ugh did not catch until the second watching what Paul was up to with that Playtex add… >_<
I'm flabbergasted.
Wait, no I'm not.
Is Pryce worried about what Mrs. Pryce will think of the traffic in India?
I love Betty for putting back that key. Brilliant move.
When is Sally going to fly her freak flag? She's got some deviant behavior to unleash.
Congrats, Peggy. Tricky Dick may not have such large shoes to fill after all?
The hang-up related scenes were delicious.
#227, Dick/Suzanne as opposed to Don/Suzanne – astute. I agree.
And Suzanne is def. getting a little creepy. Prior to this episode, I had a suicide attempt theory.
And I'm just throwing this out there for shits and giggles, but how wonderful would a scene of Roger and Betty together in bed be? Remember their boozy dinner flirtations? Betty could tell Roger he has a bigger penis than Don.
Can't wait to see Joan again. I wait with bated breath for the next three episodes.
That telegram pitch was Peggy's "Carousel" moment. She has now officially inherited Don's genius. Loved how Don put the cherry on top with the impromptu tag line: "You can't frame a phone call." GENIUS.
http://www.slate.com/id/2225274/
"So let me see if I have this straight. Turning down the unwanted sexual advances of a client: firing offense. Running over the foot of an executive with a lawn mower: not a firing offense. Poor Sal."
Don't forget, Lois worked on the switchboard. I'm sure she knows EVERYONE's secrets. That's why they keep her around — to keep her mouth shut.
Sorry to bring up Framingham again, but the scene exemplifies the production team's insane attention to detail. You can see a U.S. 20 sign in the background, which means Don dropped him off close to Rt. 126 where he would've gone north to Bedford. That stretch of U.S. 20, the Old Boston Post Road in Sudbury, has many rural/swampy areas that match the scene's shoot location.
And has anyone else noticed the recurring "laundry" theme the past several episodes? Is that part of the sponsorship agreement with Clorox?
Re: the money in the drawer.
I get the inclinations of people having lived through the Depression stashing money — for my Grandmother it was food/canning. If it stood still it got canned. Shelves and shelves of pickles, peaches and snap peas.
But — what the hell if the house burns down? Don had Thousands in that desk. pretty risky.
Betty's brother shows up in the promo for next week – does she go to her father's house for Thanksgiving to have a meeting of the minds with the Hofstadts? (she says she found something about him) Thanksgiving 1963 was November 28 – so will we be seeing Kennedy aftermath?
about Don, that is. My mind is going too fast for my fingers to type!
Abby,
They are probably at Gene II's house to divide the possessions. Betty has an eye on that nice jardinaire
Good point about Betty and the money…
My mom (born in 1922) used to eep a good stash of money in the sleeve of a coat she never wore, in the back of the closet.
Even if we only saw Betty seeing the divorce decree, there's no way she didn't look at every single scrap pf paper after she saw that. I think she definitely knows about Dick, too.
The scene with Don and Suzanne in her apartment with the red lamp between them was beautifully shot.
To Solome, and those who have not lived as long as I, with regard to why Peggy didn't just tape over her belch, the early dictaphone machines of the 60's had this two inch wide tape thing that you wound around a cylinder, you spoke into it, and gave the raw tape to your secretary, but you could not back it up to tape over it, you could only use it once. This was way before cassette tapes. Those things were absolutely horrible.
#259 – Right. She certainly had plenty of time to pore over everything in that box – she sent the children out and brooded about it until after 2 a.m., courtesy of Mr. Draper.
I didnt see anything in that box that would make Betty think that Don was Dick.
Betty told Carla to take the kids out to the park, library and bring them back at suppertime. She had lots of time to inventory the box.
Where's Baby Gene in all this?
There were pictures of Don that were labeled "Dick" and "Adam" – I'm sure "Dick" was on the other pictures. Two sets of dog tags.
Isn't there a picture marked "Dick and Adam" of Don is his military uniform? Or is that the one he burned S1? What about the one of him next to the car? That could say "Dick" also.
I'm glad I found this blog. And sad that there are only 3 episodes left…this went so fast. They need to call this a "mini season" – not a season at all!!!!!
The next three epps will be awesome.
I think Betty keeps her newly found knowledge under wraps. I think she goes home next week because the house may be sold, but she wants to try to keep it for now. Her "plan B" if she and Don go south. Or hell, her "plan A" because she's finally leaving him. But she's going to gather more info, I guarantee.
The teacher is certifiable. Those of you that can't see it is beyond me. And now with that brother having Don's card? No good can come of that.
That next week's preview? Please let Joan be calling Roger for her job back…please, please, please. Because she can't move to Alabama with Greg. She just can't.
Finally, Paul looked at Peggy with more than just "awe." She took up for him and helped him with Don. Methinks he's got a crush on our Peggy. And how delicious will that be? A Paul/Pete rivalry! Over Peggy! And if our Joanie came back, didn't she a Paul have a thing going on before he opened his big mouth? What an interesting build up to office tensions for Season 4.
God I love this show!
I really enjoyed the scene of Peggy taking into the tape recorder. I kept waiting for her to say "strike that," at some point and continue. What Peggy was doing seemed so familiar to me. When I had serious writer's block working on a paper, sometimes I'd just talk into a tape-recorder for a while, just saying what came to mind, and after playing it back, I'd have some pretty good ideas of what direction to take.
I loved the outfit Peggy was wearing during the meeting with Don and Paul. Betty's up-do hairstyle for the party at the end was stunning. My friend and I agreed that both Don and Roger looked especially wonderful in tuxedos.
#271, I like the house angle.
And Don has certainly been careless recently. Will he end up having to give little brother a job?…
I've just watched the encore presentation of tonight's episode and I've got to say that I loved it. IMO, Matt Weiner and the writers are showing exactly what Dick/Don truly wants in his life. He wants that spotlight. He wants to be acknowledged and recognized for what he's achieved in his professional life. He's on contract with SC and Hilton, but he's gaining more power.
The moment when Paul realized how talented and smart Peggy truly is, was fabulous. She just ran with his thought in that meeting. He would have never made that connection and that's why Don and her make such a great team. They both think on their feet.
I want Betty to leave Don. I feel so bad for her, because the more she finds out about him, the more she's going to realize that she doesn't have a clue about the man that she married AND that she's just a showpiece.
#267
The pictures with Dick written on the back were foggy and from when he was very young. and one could always think
that Dick was a nickname?
But then you have the "Dick Whitman" dog tags.
Even if Betty does confront Don about his past lies, what can she do? Divorce him? Expose him as an Army deserter? She could probably divorce him, but it's not going to do her much good. I doubt that she can solely depend upon him for alimony. She also has three children to raise. We don't even know if her father has left her any money. And she has a B.S. degree in anthropology. How is that going to help her? She would need to return to school for a higher degree in order to teach the subject. At least I think so. I could be wrong.
If Weiner decides to end the Draper marriage this season or early next season, then we'll have to watch Betty struggle to make ends meet or create a new career for herself for the remaining seasons.
I think they'll end up staying together, but with more bitterness and without the blinders.
I've never heard of Dick as a nickname for Donald, but I didn't know any Donalds growing up.
Paul and Lois are fit for each other in this messed up sort of way. That scene with them trying to find the phantom idea was hilarious. I hope that someone will break the fourth wall and explain why she's still at SC, though. Because you know they know we're wondering. Just like I'm still wondering about that whole Duck situation…
Oh, I started this to say that Betty is always wearing blue in these big revelation episodes. When Jimmy told her about Don and Bobbie she had on that turquoise gown. And her polka-dot dress from 'A Night to Remember' featured blue. Tonight she wore blue to the anniversary gala. Maybe blue's her color but it's not necessarily her good luck color.
And I wanted to say thanks to helene_bedd for responding to my post…there are so many here I assume people just skim over infrequent posters.
What was with the 2 sets of tags, actually? I thought he left the Dick ones on the real Don's body, but maybe the army let him have both because he was the only other guy in that squadron or whatever?
Stace, it looked like she's wearing her blue coat (from holding Glen's hand and rejecting Arthur!!) in the next episode. I love that freaking coat.
Still having Dick Whitman's dog tags in the box makes no sense. When the real Don Draper was killed in Korea, the best way to make the authorities think that Dick died would be to switch dog tags. That means putting Dick's dog tags on or near Don's body, while taking Don's dog tags for himself. Just before he died, the real Don told Dick that he was about to be sent home.
It's possible that the Dick Whitman dog tag went to the Whitman family, when the real Don Draper's body was handed over to them for burial. The Whitman family received the dog tag and maybe Adam left it with the other family mementos before killing himself.
Stace (279)
As a frequent commenter, I can say that I skim, but not on a frequent/infrequent commenter basis. Indeed, during open thread, I'm more likely to answer someone's question, if I think I know the answer.
Re: the dog tags
Most likely, the Dick tags were sent to the Whitman family, and Don likely got them via Adam.
If Betty confronts him about the photos of Dick, Don could always say that Dick was his dead twin brother. He could even say they were raised in different families to explain the different surnames. This could have happened to poor children during the Depression.
D'oh! Of course, Adam had kept Dick's tags and left them in the box he mailed to Don/Dick. But it was stupid of Don to keep them.
@ 284 Karl-That explanation makes sense to me. The dog-tags seem like the kind of thing Adam would have held onto and put in the box. When Adam committed suicide, the box was sent to Don, which is why Don would have both sets of dog tags.
@ 285 Peggy Joan- While that explanation does make sense in the context of the Depression, I don't think Betty would believe it, because she has no way of knowing when Don is lying, and when he's telling the truth. I suspect she'd think that everything is a lie at this point.
Thought it was a nice touch that Don received 5G in an episode hinging so much on the memento box and Don's guilt over poor Adam.
just wanted to say thank you to the Lipp sisters and all of you who post about the episodes. you really add to the pleasure of watching this show.
SallyB, so glad you noted the keys.
Melville – yes, it's delicious that Betty's anger is about the one thing that's a lie.
Don d. Dick is really going with that double life thing with Betty and Suzanne. nice insight. I've tagged her as a little off since the drunk dialing but maybe she's just more honest than I'm accustomed to with MM characters. It's strange to see Don, I mean Dick, so smitten.
I also LOVE that the show had more office scenes. Peggy and Don work well together. That creative give and take is soooooo satisfying. anyone care for a cigarette? Paul was owned by Ken and the story in the Atlantic, called out by Joan on his girlfriend, (even if they did get to cha cha) dumped by her after a long weekend, jerks off to his own ad copy, and sees why Peggy has earned her place in the firm. After she covered for him. eat it, Paul. great observation, Dimples.
lol. maybe Freddy Rumson did flight of the bumblebee with his zipper for dictation.
wait till Embeth's character finds out she's going to India. maybe Pryce will trade on what he knows about selling S-C to get to stay in the U.S. with them. Tom Sawyer did speak to him about eulogies.
DRush76: That's what I thought. Karl, Anne B, or Lipp Sisters, anyone that's been watching from the beginning, please help out here. Dick as Don Draper accompanies the body (the REAL Don) and sees his family waiting at the station. He tells the other officer that he can't do it. (That's when small Adam sees him in the train window.) So he has all Don Draper's dogtags. But the box that Adam sends him, after his suicide, contains the Dick Whitman dogtags, pictures of their past, and the cash Don tried to buy him off with. That's the same box that Pete had. And for some reason, I always thought Pete returned it without the money. And now that's the box that Betty found.
Is this right? Corrections are encouraged! Thank you Basketcases!
Who was the wrong number? Bunny boiler says nope. Dashing older fling says nope. Anna? Joy?……
Freddy Rumson identified his zipper music as Mozart. It was Eine Kleine Nachtmusick
#291 – randomness transmogrified by secrets. it's almost halloweeeeeen. spooky.
JoanvsJane, I think you've got it right, except for the money. Adam's landlord said something to Don about the money going to the state because Adam didn't have any next of kin, so the money wasn't in the box when Pete got hold of it.
yes, but maybe Freddie expanded his repetoire. A girl can hope.
@ 290 – The money that was in the box that Adam sent back to Don/Dick, was taken out, as I recall, by Don. I'm probably wrong.
Esme – Thanks for the shoutout, but it's been very clear from season 2 that Peggy's the smartest copywriter at SC. Paul wants to be valued like Cosgrove and the tv guy (can't remember the character's name), but he will never be in that position. I'm just glad that the writers had a scene in which Paul recognizes Peggy's talent. Cosgrove acknowledged it in season 1, Don promoted her in season 2 and her co-worker has recognized it in the third season.
#294 Lissie: Okay thanks. Also, another possible stupid question: I know Matt does a commentary on each episode on the DVD's of past seasons, but hasn't he spoken about a few of this seasons epps? And they've been subjects of various posts on here? If so, where are y'all going to here/read about MW's comments for this season? Thank you again.
Lissie, Betty gets some of the best costume love out of all the characters. I love when she dresses up because I am always wowed. I sew and am obsessed with costuming so I pay too much attention to what everyone wears. And sometimes it relates to the story, sometimes not. That blue coat seems to be a sort of security blanket for Betty, at times.
And Karl, thank you(you're one of my favorite people here btw…that whole washer/dryer thing with you and Aran in the other post had me laughing out loud). I appreciate that. I don't worry about it, but it's cool when someone thinks what you're saying is useful…especially here with so many insightful people.
Hi, first time poster, long time MM fanatic.
In response to the questions about how the heck Lois could still be at SC, I recall that in Season 2 Lois made a deal with Harry, Ken and Paul that in return for divulging the news of SC's sale, one of them had to promise to "take her off the switchboard." Looks as if Paul was the lucky recipient.
I had the same question about the tags, but the Adam angle seems likely.
The train ride seemed to me another Hitchcock image — it's the same rail line as in North by Northwest, only they are traveling in the opposite direction. Maybe a little tenuous, but it was a strong image for me.
dimples – don't forget Freddie who got her into the mix with… basket of kisses.
Stace, you're more than welcome. This is my (and about 20 other people's, it seems) first time posting here. I dig the different perspectives. It's like watching TV with my friends, except smarter. Ha!
And I'm now watching the episode for the third time. “I see how hard you’re working,†is so smart, #199.
Also, I hope I know how to leave a room.
I thought Paul's idea from Achilles was, "when someone calls out Western Union, everyone looks up."
I enjoyed the ad idea scenes tonight.
"The faintest print is better than the sharpest memory." Like the printed material in the box.
Can't stand Teach and the brother. Bore.
Hullabaloo: Ahh that does make sense that they would keep Lois because she knows too much from her days on the switch board.
60sdaughter: Oooo I didn't catch the 5G thing… spooky.
#300 I thought of "Strangers on a Train" and N by NW, too. And, the music when Betty opens the box seemed to evoke the music in "Psycho" when Vera Miles goes through Norman Bates' desk.
# 298 Stace Says: "I sew and am obsessed with costuming so I pay too much attention to what everyone wears. And sometimes it relates to the story, sometimes not."
You're not alone. I sew & used to work in garment retail (advertising side).
If you think you pay too much attention, them let me tell you:
Don and Harry both wear their pocket kerchief's folded flat with a quarter-to-half inch above the pocket binding.
Roger wears his in a tri-fold.
Conrad Hilton doesn't wear kerchiefs, even though his suits have a breast pocket. and~~ most of the other staff Paul, Pete…wear jackets that have no pocket at all.
*disclosure: one of my best-mates at a former job was a menswear buyer of 20+ years. I notice the details of men's clothing way more than normal – I've been scolded for missing things, you see. ha.
I was just trying to figure out what Paul's Big Idea was, #304. I'm a bad copywriter, though. Sorta like Paul.
Just caught the slight tinkle of the keys in Don's robe when Betty threw it into the hamper. Lovely.
oh wow….I just noticed — The banner for this site (home page) has Bert Cooper…with a 4-fold pocket kerchief. Like a 4-star general ! cool
#303 helene_bedd-"It’s like watching TV with my friends, except smarter."
That's a great ad slogan for BoK!
#304- “The faintest print is better than the sharpest memory.†Like the printed material in the box.
!! Or like the printed material on that business card Don gave Suzanne's brother. Great way to tie it all together, 25framesaminute.
I know there will probably be a post about the blue items and symbolism, but just noticed that the napkin Don had in the Aqua Net scene is blue.
I love Betty's bracelet, the one with the heart.
I like Suzanne for Dick, because he can be himself, and I see her helping Dick/Don to be able to merge his two sides. She can also help to bring him through the changeover that's taking place culturally. Will he be able to stay faithful? That's a big question, and Suzanne definitely won't sweep it all under the carpet like Betty. Big drama to come.
Betty divorces Don and marries Henry. He's sort of boring, but stays faithful.
I think Sally goes completely radical and becomes a protest leader.
Sally becomes a protest leader later, when she's older. Not when she's ten 🙂
Foreshadowing? What is written down is forever … phone calls are fleeting… I'm convinced Suzanne's brother (who needs $$) will shortly be blackmailing Don.
I'm surprised (having read through 309 posts!) very little mentions of the final scene. I thought it was devestating – almost painful to watch. As they list all the parts of Don Draper – it's as if he is being punched. Husband – punch, father – punch, friend – punch, genius -punch. It's lies on top of lies on top of lies. Roger isn't his friend, the company doesn't value him, he's not a family man – it was awful. I was surprised to see Don's easy, gracious attitude. I expected the scene to end with Don looking across the room and then having some kind of nervous breakdown.
What do you guys think Betty will do next? Instead of confronting him – will she build a case and do something revengeful?
And we thought the Kennedy assasination linkage to MM would be tough to predict!
SallyB, you are now my new best Basketcase friend. 😉 You are more detailed oriented than my mother who's been a seamstress for years. Been trying to get her to watch the show but I'm not sure if she'd get all the subtext. She was the same age as Sally Draper in 1963 but she definitely didn't have the same upbringing. But, I digress.
I love the men's suit but I know nothing about menswear. I did notice the difference in kerchiefs when I was watching old eps the other day and now that you mentioned it, I will notice it all the time!
@ #1 Karl:
Since I have no willpower, I tried to access the post-show-post(s), and got an Error 404. But the title(s) are intriguing…as are the tags.
Roger…best lines ever.
The real Don Draper had a college degree, so why did Dick/Don need night school?
@Andrea #56
Suzanne’s brother is the antithesis of Dennis Hobart
The brother is schizophrenic?
Well, he IS a toad.
Hmmm, interesting segment.
God, Lane can’t get a break. The poor guy just takes it from everyone.
Although I did smirk when he said, “I’ve been here 10 months and no one’s asked me where I went to school.”
That’s so British.
Betty reads Mary McCarthy’s The Group in the bathtub… I’m in the middle of it right now… I was lead to it by Meg Wollitzer’s The Wife. Here is the description from Amazon:
Mary McCarthy’s The Group is a sharply-pointed satire of upper-class New England society which follows the post-college lives of eight Vassar graduates, class of ’33. Helena was registered for Vassar at birth; Pokey forged her mother’s signature on her college application in defiance of the family tradition of “being dim-witted and vain of it.” Out in the “real” world, Dottie loses her virginity to a “bad sort” but discovers that she enjoys sex, while Kay subsumes her own talent to the artistic “genius” of her egocentric and philandering husband. Libby writes book reviews that are almost as long as the original material and Polly works as a nurse, while Priss is forced by her pediatrician-husband to go against “tradition” and her inclinations and breastfeed her baby, as proof of his theories. Elinor “Lakey” Eastlake, the sleek, rich leader of the group, travels about Europe and ultimately returns, full of surprises. Adopting the non-stop, generally well-intentioned, but hopelessly narrow-minded voice that typifies the worst of the group, Mary McCarthy filets Ivy League society, socialism, 1930s child-rearing practices, sexual double-standards, psychoanalysis, and men in general.
#277 I was giving thought to Betty divorcing, and I realized something. I'm not sure if this even matters at all, but she has the evidence to be able to an an annulment. One of the grounds for annulment is "fraud". If he lied about who he has, that seems like a pretty easy win.
Random observation of the night (and it's hard to come up with one at #317):
That was some thick fog in London…didn't they make a big to-do about it not being real–about it actually being industrial pollution?
Oh and Paul…at his desk…grabbing a towel…? Ewwww. Just ewwww. My wife was sitting there squealing that Peggy was going to walk in and…ewww.
I need an office. Slosh in some sauce, blaze a beezy, jerk my gherkin, maybe jam a little on the geetar – and then sleep it all off on my couch.
Okay, so I don't have a gherkin, but if I did…
…I'd leave the Dictaphone running. Transcribe that, Lois.
Sorry, that's enough. Good night.
This is the VA hospital in Bedford, MA; a few miles down the road from me, very nice town actually. Suzanne’s brother may have fared okay there.
http://www.bedford.va.gov/
How many weeks has it been since we’ve seen Peggy outside of work?
So sad. “I see how hard you’re working” has two meanings, doesn’t it?
@195 SallyB I agree. I could have done with less Don/Miss Farrell time, but I’m glad we got back to SC, the creative meetings, everything I love about this show (well, as much as can be without Joan anyway). And the parts that were in the Draper residence packed a punch. very satisfying episode.
@ Andrea #171
Absolutely. Paul is still reliving his one great moment (the Jackie/Marilyn ad from 3 years ago, which wasn’t even used), and Peggy can come up with the right approach out of the air. He can’t even resent her as getting ahead because she’s Don’s favorite anymore. She just showed why she’s Don’s favorite: she’s got the most talent.
I know there will probably be a post about the blue items and symbolism, but just noticed that the napkin Don had in the Aqua Net scene is blue.
@ # 310 Stace:
"Blue" has definitely been the topic of conversation here:
http://www.lippsisters.com/2009/08/07/the-new-blu…
Oh and Paul…at his desk…grabbing a towel…? Ewwww. Just ewwww. My wife was sitting there squealing that Peggy was going to walk in and…ewww.
@ # 318 dancewosleeping:
Not only that, he then shook Achilles hand with the offending hand. LOL. I was yelling at the TV, "DON'T TOUCH IT!"
# 230 meghan Says:
“How in the hell is Lois still employed?”
Ye Gods! I wondered that myself. Maybe Pryce kept her on as a hidden-thank-you for keeping him from being shipped off to India.
Thanks, hullabaloo. That shade of blue(that's almost Tiffany Blue) is all over this series! I also noticed the Draper's blue headboard seemed much more vibrant than usual.
And, I wasn't going to say it, but all this talk about Paul …servicing himself made me think about *blue* balls! LOL
Ok, I went there…sorry ya'll. Going to bed now.
First, I agree with comment #81 that the train scene was really gorgeous, I loved the light coming through the window shades.
Second, for me, the Miss Farrell character just doesn’t ring true. Her personality is all over the map. Too sophisticated to be a school teacher and too pretty to be single and living above a garage in the suburbs. She’s a youthful and idealistic school teacher who loves children in one scene and then she’s all worldly and answering the door with a cocktail in her hand in another scene. Something doesn’t jive.
Maybe there’s something more to her, something secret about her past.
And another thing, women didn’t jog back in the early 60’s. If they ran at all they did so on a track as part of a track team and not on the road and especially not in the wee hours of the morning.
re: peggy burping: I like the idea of her leaving it there just to shock the secretary. LOL
Suz,
I shudder to think of what Freddy Rumson’s secretary had to endure
Oh my god what a great episode! So.much.happened. I do think I could have gone to the end of season 3 with out knowing Paul was whacking off in his office.. yeh coulda gone a long way not knowing that.
When I first saw the brother I got the deepest chills of “uh oh, psycho time”! I heard the sound affects of the shower scene at the Bates. WEEP! WEEP! WEEP! WEEP! Don really is stumbling along here and I’m sad to see it. I was hoping redemption would come for him with some kind of classy deal, but I fear it’s going to be really dirty and really ugly.
Wow, just wow. Love all you baskets remarks tonight.. we are on fire!
#311 Betty's bracelet only has one charm on it – the heart. Don wanted her to put the Coliseum charm on it.
Ken had a damn good pitch for Western Union: "I like getting telegrams, but I never think to send one." Could have been good to work with that.
Still absorbing what went down, even with the third viewing. But it looks like the end of the marriage.
Teacher exhibited slightly stalkerish behavior, add the dodgy brother and it seems like too heavyhanded a plot development for it to appear what it might be, a family of crazies and/or grifters. So I'm assuming it's not what it appears to be.
Long time lurker, first time poster here…
Wondering if anyone else thought about what Paul's brilliant idea was for Western Union? When he first met Achilles, I immediately thought Greek mythology and Hermes (or Mercury in Roman myths) was the Messenger of the gods. I immediately thought of his winged hat being the new Western Union logo.
Thoughts?
#326 — Good take on that!
#215 — "Dick Whitman Sampler Box" + Forrest Gump = You never know what you're going to get!
This is so obvious I can't believe it hasn't been said before, so if it has, sorry…….I read all postings, but can't always remember what has been said.
The house of Betty's father would be a good place for a rendezvous with Henry…..just sayin'…..
Strangers on a Train – good one that occurred to me as well.
Also, too bad Teacher did not meet 'Dick' instead of 'Don' so that Dick/Don could really lead a double life – there are a few of those 'two household guys' from the MM era.
My wife said that Paul fell in love with Peggy in that instant of real copy writing at the end. I agree, and as an old copywriter, I am finally satisfied with a great example of a true team in operation.
Don did not just put the cherry on top with his catch phrase, "You can't frame a phone call.", he put the tag to the whole campaign. Peggy (concepts) and Paul (literary) will flesh it out into a 'Basket of Money' for SC.
Notice that the 3 of them all experienced the 'I hate when that happens' confession. We all have had middle of the night ghost ideas that never come back from the edges of our thoughts.
One thing I really like about this smartest of fan blogs: We all bring our expertise here, and there is something for all our muses.
Costume/Wardrobe query: Betty's last vision of haute – who is the designer of the gown, and what's the story on the jewellry – Cassini and Tiffany? Come folks, let's hear it…
Now back to work 😉
Perhaps Lois was kept around because she actually did them a favor by getting rid of the new Brit who was going to shake things up.
Because of Lois, Lane avoided India. Roger still had a place on the org chart. Don didn't have to deal with a new boss. And even Cooper's role was left intact. The London home office needn't know she was still there.
Maybe her accident guaranteed her a job for life!
I'm thrilled Betty is going to do some detective work before confronting Don with what she's discovered. He's already gaslighted her once and moves into bully mode when he feels he's being attacked. She needs to get her bearings and make a plan.
Brenda, quite right! I was thinking the same thing about the Laura Linney movie…this is way too derivative of that…
I've only read up to comment #153 so far, so apologies if someone else already said this, but I loved the dark foreshadowing symbolism of the laundry basket full of perfectly folded clothes falling off the bed when Betty finally gave up and went to sleep after waiting up to confront Don.
Re: Post about Embeth Davidtz and "Junebug"…agree! Absolutely phenomenal movie and her performance was brilliant.
Ok this is going to be a super crazy not at all likely idea… but is it possible that Betty won't realize Dick is Don, but will instead think Don was once*involved* with Dick? And that's why he has all his old photos and dog tags? Or would that not even enter her mind?
On the other hand, in one of the previous times Don's opened the box there was a passport in there. Could it be that he still has Dick's passport? Or does he keep his Don stuff in there as well?
I was just thinking about that box…who else besides Pete and Bert know about Don's past? Does Roger know?
Also, when Don's past was found out before (with Pete talking to Bert), Don's first instinct was run away with Rachel. I wonder if Don will try to run away with Suzanne?
The Massachusetts state prison for women is in Framingham (opened in the 19th century). Foreshadowing, red herring, or coincidence?
Suzy and her brother remind me of the grifters. Uh oh.
#288: brilliant connection to 5G.
#290: The shoebox never had the cash. When Adam hung himself, he left the money stacked up on his dresser and the city confiscated it, as the hotel manager explained to Don over the phone.
#291: I rather think it was just a plain ol’ hang up call, with no meaning, and the importance was the way that Don and Betty each reacted.
#304: GREAT!
And WELCOME to all the newcomers!
I do not think that Betty would imagine Dick being invovled with Don – that's very much a more modern thing.
Next week's episode is entitled "The gypsy and the hobo". We already know Don (Dick) is an honorary hobo from "The Hobo Code". We also know Suzanne has moved around teaching jobs. (gypsy?) I'm not sure that Suzanne is a grifter or a bunny boiler, but I do think there is some backstory that is relevant. Why has she moved around? I would think a prior scandalous affair with a parent at another school would get her barred from teaching at other schools.
I agree with other posters that Dick connects to her — perhaps because she has daddy issues, too? Baby brother issues? Is she the gypsy?
You could definitely make the argument that this storyline is too contrived, but MW is using it to illuminate who Don/Dick really is and maybe even providing the catalyst for him to reveal his true identity. I don't think it's the affair/philandering part that is relevant, but what in her that he sees that exposes him. (if that makes any sense)
OT: Why are some names in black and some in red?
Scanning the names, my guess is registered vs non-registered users?
OR, names with links affiliated vs not so much linked?
This is a test…. think it has to do with linked websites…
Yep! I put in our store's addy and my name lit up! Well, at least THAT is off my to-do list!
When Paul watched Peggy develop that creative idea with Don just spontaneously, I immediately saw Freddy Rumson's face when Peggy said, "Here's your basket of kisses".
Paul just witnessed "a dog playing a piano", as Freddy so ungentlemanly put it.
#278. Even "THE Donald" hasn't grown up ?
#340 — "I would think a prior scandalous affair with a parent at another school would get her barred from teaching at other schools."
You're kidding, right?
All they did with priests was move them around.
Few thoughts
@252 – Matthew I think you are right, Don was likely on Route 20. Parts of Route 20 still look like that today actually, albeit not the ones that close to Boston. But if you drive out near Worcester, there are some parts of 20 that are pretty dark at night. 20 also parallels the Mass pike, more or less, through the entire state.
As for Lane, did anyone else get the sense that he never told his wife about India, likely because he never had to since Guy was maimed the same day as he was told about the transfer, thus sealing his continued presence at SC. I have come to really enjoy his character, but I was intrigued by the fact that his wife offered the same criticism of him that his boss did, namely that he always does as he is told. This is another instance here appearances are not what the seem in this episode.
As for Betty, as many posters have noted, she goes right for the divorce papers. My question is will she put the Don/Dick connection together? When Don wouldn't sign the contract he said it was because he has all the power. Does this give her all the power over Don?
As for the sale of SC, I have two thoughts in my head. 1)Lane stays and works with Don, Roger and Bert to raise enough money to buy back the company, maybe even add Don's name to the wall. Assuming they all haven't gone and spent what they were paid for the initial sale, they probably have the collateral to do it. The should have no problem raising the capital with clients like Lucky Strike and Hilton. Or 2) does Duck somehow re-emerge and attempt to have Gray purchase SC to screw Don?
I'm conflicted here, as logic would lead me to believe that Don/Roger/Bert would not want to pay a premium for a company in which they were partners just 10 months previously. Is this a logical exit point for Burt to allow Don to takeover the reigns? And if Betty knows Don's secret, will he really want his name on the side of the building.
If something like this happens, it will have interesting parallels to the end of S2. As SC was being sold, Roger was going through a divorce and wanted to keep his money from Mona. If Betty wants a divorce, will she blackmail Don and compromise his ability to take a stake in an independent SC?
Awesome episode.
@ 313 Lisa-In 4 years it will be 1967 and Sally will be 14. Someone 14 could have a friend with an older sibling in high school or college. The friend's older sibling will be Sally's link to the protest movement/counterculture. I've known people who were rather young to be have been in protests during that era, but they went because they had older siblings who took them.
#348 — I'm not kidding because I think the church protecting a male member of the clergy is very different than a school system's treatment of a "loose woman". In that day, even married school teachers couldn't let on that they were pregnant — they were let go. When checking references, all a school would have to do is hint that the teacher had a sullied reputation and she wouldn't be hired. I'm not saying Suzanne didn't have affairs with parents in the past (we know she did), I'm just saying I'm not convinced that she had full out disastrous, scandalous ones (of the bunny-boiling variety). But, I very well could be wrong, past affairs could be behind her past moves.
@ # 349 Federalist – "2) does Duck somehow re-emerge and attempt to have Gray purchase SC to screw Don?"
My thoughts exactly. As soon as I heard SC was for sale, I just knew that Duck would somehow figure into it.
According to "My Old Kentucky Home" or some other episode, Betty told someone that she and Don had been married for nine years. Either they were married in early 1954 or late 1953. If that's the case and since Sally's birthday is in the early spring . . . I think that Sally's birth date was in the early spring of 1955.
Suzanne told Don early on that he was probably just like all the others…she must have had prior affairs with school parents, but flew under the radar. She's trouble for sure. I also don't believe that she didn't call their house.
I think there could be some tragedy in store for Ms Farrell — she may be good for Dick Whitman, but not for Don Draper. And Don Draper, the successful and much-admired businessman with the perfect life, is who he REALLY wants to be. That's why he came back to Betty…she's a trophy wife that he can parade around much better than the women Dick Whitman is actually attracted to. Don keeps his Dick Whitman-self hidden in a box, and currently only lets this part of himself sneak about in the "wee hours." Suzanne Farrell can never really have Don Draper, and that will lead to…?
Sally said “I heard her breathe.â€
Hmmm. Maybe. OTOH, how can you tell if it's a male or female breathing?
Also, hanging up — because of wrong number, playing games, whatever — was very common back then before Caller ID, *69 and all that. You realized you reached the wrong party (or one you really didn't want to talk to!) and you just hung up. Not like today when you know someone has your phone number on caller ID and you feel compelled to explain your mistake, even if it's an innocent one. Not saying it wasn't Suzanne, because it was really really easy to make a call like that, just in the off chance she'd get Don answering and then hang up without consequences. I remember back in those days it was only if you were getting very persistent, threatening hang-ups would you call the phone company and asked to have the calls traced. But that was a pretty big deal, and you only did it if you felt you were being harassed.
It was so much easier to be anonymous back then!
I'll throw in another hidden gem of subtle interaction and a wink from the writers to those who are paying attention, Don comes home to dinner, asks Sally how was school, wallflower Bobby actually gets to say something to his Dad, "How come you never ask me? "I do, but you take too long so I ask Sally first" Ouch!
Poor Bobby, the only attention he get's is negative, when being a punching bag for his sis, he gets flippantly punished by his Mom for doing anything more than breathing and now Don works the dismissive con job on him, little Booby has no voice, ahh, the hard partying 70's are awaiting him, 10 to 1 odds he won't survive them.
Sorry – must finish obsessing on my point about why I believe it was Suzanne calling their house. Sally said “I heard her breathe.” Hel-loooo! Why would that dialogue be there otherwise? Surely, Suzanne was stuck once Sally — perhaps unexpectedly — answered the phone. There was nothing she could say w/o getting caught. I think that given the more civilized phone manners of the day, someone merely getting a wrong number and hearing a child answer the phone would certainly have actually asked for the party they were trying to reach, politely apologized, and said “sorry, wrong number” before hanging up.
@ # 355 Elizabeth –
I agree, I believe it was Suzanne Farrell that called. When she told Don on the train that she didn’t…well, she seemed a little hesitant in her response. Besides, we’ve already seen her make 1 inappropriate call to the Draper home already, right?
# 350 – “I’ve known people who were rather young to be have been in protests during that era, but they went because they had older siblings who took them.”
RetroGirl, I went to my first anti-war protest, at the Pentagon, on my 14th birthday, in 1968.
The next year, at one of the Vietnam Moratorium marches in DC (either Oct or Nov) we marched past the old FBI Building on Pennsylvania Ave. and saw ol’ J. Edgar Hoover himself, scowling down at us, so we flipped him off!
@#353 – Re Sally’s age…
In Episode 12, Season 2, The Mountain King, taking place sometime in October 1962, Don answers Anna’s question that “Sally is eight and Bobby is five.”
In Season 1, Episode 3, The Marriage of Figaro, (early April 1960) Don brought home Polly the dog instead of Sally’s birthday cake–so that would put Sally at nine and a half years old
being born in April 1954.
Don ( J.R.) to Betty ( Sue Ellen ): “Darlin’, you gonna’ believe me or your lyin’ eyes?”
Interesting choice to name her character "Suzanne Farrell," who was "the most influential American ballerina of the late 20th century," as well as George Balanchine's muse. Is she Don's muse?
@#358 Madnesse: You are absolutely right…in fact didn't their whole flirtation really start there…with that first phone call?
Unless I missed it, nobody has mentioned the pillow talk between Don and Suzanne about the boy in her class that asked about the color blue and how he could be sure that what he sees is what every one else sees. Don’s response is: “…People may see things differently but they don’t really want to.” Does this mean people see him differently but they don’t want to? That he sees her differently? That he sees their relationship differently?
I don’t know what it means… but there’s something there. Thoughts?
He also mentions, in that same scene, that girls don’t wear their hair long and curly anymore. More reference (along with the Aqua Net symbolism) to the prim and proper/contained hair styles. Boy is that about to change…
Another theme of this ep. (and I think this was mentioned in another thread is some form): Memory. Paul forgets his great idea. Roger’s mother is losing hers. You remember a telegram, but not a phone call. Don forgets his key in his pocket.
As for Paul, I don’t think he was in awe of Peggy at the end. He seemed mad to me. I thought he assumed that she took his notes while he was passed out. I don’t think he wanted Don to know that he lost his great idea, but she pushed him to fess up. And then she overshadowed him again. He’s pissed.
And I haven’t even touched on Betty and the box… so much to think about this week!
350 ~ Retrogirl
Glen Bishop. I’ve joked that he will take Sally to Woodstock.
Any thoughts on the woman holding the candlestick phone in the photograph Roger referred to when he held up the picture and said to Yodabert, "Remember her?" Cooper's reaction was priceless.
Does anyone know if Don sends money to Anna, in addition to buying her house? If he does, that would explain the money in the drawer; it wouldn't do to have canceled checks to Anna Draper lying around the house, and back then sending cash through the mail wasn't the risk it is now. Although, I also agree with previous posts about Don being a person of the depression (the old "money in the mattress" thing).
@ #304 25framesaminute: My husband came up with the same slogan. We were both doing the, "I hate when that happens!" when Paul woke up hangover, unable to remember his great idea because he failed to write it down.
Re: the hang-up call: I think it was Suzanne Farrell. I surmise she'll call the house, Sally will pick up the extension, and overhear something she shouldn't. BANG.
"Don keeps his Dick Whitman-self hidden in a box, and currently only lets this part of himself sneak about in the “wee hours.â€
Do we really think that Don/Dick is a split personality? He's Don when he's good and Dick when he's bad? No, they're the same person, with Don a name and an opportunity to escape from his life as Dick. Don doesn't morph into Dick when the going gets rough. He's reinvented himself but he still is Dick Whitman acting the part of Don Draper. Dick is Don's secret life. We all have secrets, don't we?
So many posters have commented on how they're glad to be back in the "office" with scenes of campaigns, pitches and agency work. I agree. I get bored when we're away from SC for too long.
Suzanne could be the best thing or the worst thing that happens to Don. She's all that Betty isn't; but she looks like trouble to me.
I don't think "you're just like all the rest" has to mean "I know because I've done them all." It could just mean "A lot of fathers of my kids think they're God's gift to the unmarried teacher and get all bent out of shape when I let them know they have nothing I want." I think she's weird with Don because from the minute he shows up at the parent conference (which no other father has done) she knows he does have something she wants and is really conflicted about it. It's a lose lose for her and she knows it but she really really wants him. And is kind of mad at him for that.
Whatever the "truth" about her character may be, though, she obviously pushes a lot of buttons for viewers.
adwoman:
"For all we know he could be Batman." I don't think there's a split personality thing going on with Don/Dick, but I do think there's a dual-identity aspect to him, like Batman. Don is the ideal. Dick is flawed, ordinary. It's more than just playacting; Don is the realization of Dick's potential, made flesh. He's what Dick needed to overcome his self-limitations. He's the transformative catalyst, it's almost alchemical.
Question: If Don signed the contract with Don Draper, and it comes out that he is not, in fact, Don Draper, then that contract is null and void (I think). Now, with SC possibly being sold, how could that play into a story line–especially if Duck's firm buys them. Random thoughts…
#370 spike:
To me, the Don/Dick split represents the two sides of everyone's personality only Don's had a defining moment. We seem to want him to be all good (or all bad) and some posters think he's redeemed himself at times, but he is who he is. At times the drama is overdrawn and (in my opinion) overwritten. But Don had an opportunity to change the exterior of his life and took it; he didn't change his psyche. There's still the duality.
Timeframe — Don complains to Pryce that it took "two months" for his signing bonus (from Seven Twenty-Three) to come through. Ergo, it's late-September-ish.
@Pamela (#207): I figured that Betty didn't look to closely at the photos because she has no idea who "Dick and Adam" are. But she knows Don Draper (or at least thought she did), so seeing his name on a divorce certificate captures all of her attention. Given the way she first reacted to Helen Bishop, that doesn't surprise me in the least.
@60sdaughter (#288): "5G" Very nice.
Suzanne definitely has the Crazy Eyes (copyright Barney Stinson). I don't know that she'll actually slide into "bunny boiler" territory, but there's something not-quite-normal about her interactions with Don. I think that all of her moving around is probably due to her brother. He can't hold down a job because of his epileptic "fits", so the two of them have probably kept moving so that she can keep watching over him. In a way, she seems to be trying to protect Don from himself, as well. I honestly don't see what he sees in her, but it seems to make him… content in the moment, if not happy.
As for Betty, I was kind of glad to see Henry put her in her place. Everyone — Don, Gene, Helen Bishop — has been telling her to grow up for years now, and it never sinks in. She can act mature for a little while, but always seems to revert to her poor little rich girl baseline. That makes me feel so sad for her, because I don't think she's really gained the tools that would allow her to finish becoming an adult. Maybe this episode will finally be the catalyst that prompts her to do so.
It seems like only one other person on this entire forum recognized that Paul gave Peggy the "you little sneak" look during her WU pitch. He thinks she stole his idea that he "wrote down." It was clear as day.
Erika, that was definitely not "you little sneak." When I finish transcribing my interview, you can see exactly what Michael Gladis said about it.
I like the relationship between Don and Suzanne. There is tenderness between them ; when they have the pillow talk, Don smiles as I never seen him before, he holds his hand ; he seems to really care about her. Betty is a very beautiful woman but she is trapped in a life she hates and it spoils her relationship to her husband (and her kids), the housewife syndrom.
Suzanne said that she didn't care about Don's marriage and job but the first to say that he didn't care about the environment was Don, last week ; in a way, she is just following him
@364MitchM I was sorta thinking Bobby might grow up to be Big from Sex in the City, NYC exec, nice clothes, commitment issues, adultery but since he had a much milder upbringing than Don, he does it much more pleasantly. What sparked that thought was remember an ep in S&C where he and Carrie were singing "Moon River" from "Breakfast at Tiffany's" and he said it always made him think of his parents who loved the movie and the song and who'd play it when they were getting ready to go out. NOt that Don and Betty would do that exactly, but it would place them in the same range, and you never know, maybe they get a little frisky when we aren't watching when they have the long time laspes between seasons . Just a thought 🙂
I read most of the comments above, but did not see this mentioned: In the scene where Betty is doing the laundry, the clothes are all pink, except for the robe.
Also, on the timeframe: They talk about kids going back to school, and I believe Halloween is even referenced at somepoint.
When I watched the episode a second time, I wondered why Alison Brie was listed in the opening credits.
And later I realized, Trudy Campbell was actually in the episode! You can see her sitting right next to Pete in the last scene when Roger is delivering his speech.
So this means one of two things:
1) There was a scene with a dialogue between Trudy and Pete that was cut.
or
2) the makers of the series are so obsessed with the little details that they paid Alison Brie an episode's salary for an appearance of a few seconds.
After watching it again, let me add that the same thing applies to Laura Regan (Jennifer Crane).
Isn't that crazy/great? How many would have noticed if these two were missing at the last scene?