I’m having a hard time with Ken’s being dateless for Roger’s party.
Clearly it was a deliberate choice on the writers (Dahvi Waller and Matt), perhaps to show give Pete a little one-up in this Head of Accounts competition. And I admit I am no expert on the period, but the impression I get is that at that time and in that place, you absolutely knew to bring a date to an event. It was not something you would consider and then pass on; it was understood. Maybe maybe maybe your date would cancel at the last minute, and you’d have to scramble, and even then you’d go through the proverbial or perhaps even literal black book and start going farther down the preferred list. And Ken would know this better than anyone, and probably has more numbers than most. Hell, he also has access to professionals, he might even in this case be willing to go that route.
Remember that in a somewhat more intimate setting, the Drapers’ dinner party in A Night to Remember, Duck had planned on bringing a date. I had found this shocking, but in a Mad-Men-shows-me-period-things-that-just-kill-me-because-really-who-does-that kind of way.
Duck: I’m sorry I’m late. My date canceled.
Betty: Oh, you should have called. I might have been able to replace her.
And:
Duck: Sorry I’m late. I didn’t want to come stag.
Don: Nobody cares.
Duck: I don’t know. My wife hated odd numbers.
So I’m sorry, but I’m not buying it.
82 Responses to “Ken was stag?”
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I don't know if I would define The Draper's as middle-class…but I agree that they should be moving up in the world. Maybe by next season they will be moving into a larger home, it would fit with Don's new money situation. And Ken may have went to Columbia but he still doesn't belong in that country club world. Don finally made it to the level and he was still schooled by Roger that he could be thrown out of it just as easily.
Anne, I mentioned that up thread.
I left a word out of the sentence, but I mentioned it. (#23)
I think it's a combination of it being a last minute invite, Ken not having an *appropriate* girl to bring, and his thinking he might meet someone there.
In any case, it illustrates how "not quite ready for prime time" Ken really is. He may be very good at his job, but back then a man's professional ascendance had a lot to do with whether or not he was married, and also to whom he was married.
Ever since the dinner Sal invited Ken to in season 2, I've been pretty convinced he was in the closet. Too many odd moments, and what he said to Sal back at the office — something like "you've got exactly what I want" — keeps sticking with me. Seems like they were trying to draw a pretty clear line there. Although I like the idea that he represents the youth culture that doesn't really get societal etiquette, I don't really buy that he wouldn't have known to bring a date, or that he just wouldn't care. Given the fact that we've never even seen the guy's apartment or anything really about his personal life, and they made a point to portray him as more of a womanizer than the rest, I feel like his big reveal might be that he's gay.
First time commenter. Love the site!
DH, IatS, welcome!
And yet, I'm gonna shoot you down : )
I just do not think that Ken is gay. Sorry, y'all, I don't. There's nothing that feels gay to me about him, and his 'the juiciest gazelle is the easiest to catch' is frankly, more insightful about women than most of the men on the show. Or the men that I know, for that matter.
Time will tell of course, but I'm not feeling it.
Ken did twig to the advantage of having a date, but I don't think the evening hurt him much, as the Brits didn't seem to be there, and Ken (like Pete) was presumably discouraged from hustling business.
Ken is easily the sketchiest character from S-C. I know they don't have time to do everyone's private life in depth, but we should at least know as much about him as we do about Harry or Paul. Does Weiner just not want to get too "meta" with his writer character?
Yeah, a guy his age is getting to the point where being very single, as he has been the entire series as far as we know, is bound to make people suspicious of him. (That's why I don't think he's a slam dunk to get the head of accounts job over Pete.) But given that he hits on pretty much every unattached woman in sight and we've yet to see him do anything but miss, I'm not reading "gay" from him. (If he is, that's about the deepest closeting job I've ever seen.)
I'm thinking he just does not know how to do much of anything with women except maybe pick them up, take them out on a casual date, and maybe have quick sex with them, and I'd concur with some of the other posters here that the few women he knows well enough to ask to an occasion like this would fit in like Boris Spassky at a monster truck rally. (Remember, he's likely pushing 30, an age where, back then, there weren't that many age-appropriate single women left. Not only were you "supposed" to show up with a date, but she'd better have been 0-3 years younger than you, no more, no less.) It might be highly unusual for a guy like that to come stag, but he's probably thinking, they know me, they know I'm not involved with anyone, if I drag someone here I barely know they'll know it's BS, and what if she embarrasses me? (As we saw with Jane and Roger, that's a very real possibility.)
And yes, I know I spelled "embarasses" wrong.
I just think Ken doesn’t know any girls that would be acceptable to bring to this function. As co-head of accounts he can’t really bring anyone from the typing pool, which are the only women we generally see him with. We haven’t seen him with any quality females. Just easy pickups from the automat and “hired” talent for the clients. He probably thought he would mingle with women there, but didn’t realize that everyone would be coupled off.
I don’t think he’s closeted, just clueless. He’s likely never felt anything serious for a girl (how tragic for a writer to have not had his heart broken yet!).He is just now realizing that romantically it might be time to grow up a bit for both personal and career reasons.
Before the entrance of Smitty into the ring, I really though Ken and Peggy were going to get closer this season, as he sees her as a person now and is always genuinely affectionate and very happy for her success. Before when she was the “new girl” she was just another potential notch.
Wait, what, you spelled embarrasses right, Meowser. Unless they spell it differently in my country, heh.
I think if Ken was deep in the closet he'd be the first guy with a date.
I really think Ken it's going to come up that Ken's a slacker because of the way the pregnant belly-toucher mentioned that you can't go stag to these things. Like Pete will get enraged that Ken does not bother himself with things he should.
YES, I'd forgotten that the belly-toucher said that. That kind of Weiner echo is never a coincidence, as we know.
And I know I have no evidence of this, but I am entirely convinced that Ken hooks up all the time. Oh wait, Allison with the panties was a win. But okay other than Allison, I feel like we are seeing a few sinks in a sea of swimmm.
No, Elaine, you're right. Correcting my erratum.
(slinks off with tail between legs)
I'm thinking that Ken (even more than Peggy, who's much younger) might be the character to push the storyline of America's changing attitude towards singleness. They're not far out from the years where anyone who was past about age 23 and not yet married, or at least paired up with someone permanently, was regarded with suspicion in all but the most bohemian of circles. In the 1960s, that definitely started to change, and the median age at first marriage started going up and divorce was easier to get, so there was a pool of older single people that didn't exist in the prior decade, people who were perfectly "marriageable" but were not married, and in many cases were in no rush to wed (or re-wed). Older women and younger men together started to become less taboo, too.
This is going to sound a bit weird and wrong… but I thought that during Roger's blackface scene it was a bit of a taking sides moment because most of us are going to care how the characters react to that and think better of Pete than others who didn't look weirded out. I think the contrast between Ken being stag and Pete and Trudy being a hit will relate to their rivalry but I can't guess how. But Pete is more of the odd man out in his reaction to Roger and Ken is more of the odd man out in his not having a date. Pete is different in a way that we would respect and Ken is different in a way that we would find superficial. So "it's on" between the two of them and that's my comparison. Right now Pete is up in the "his own man" department and Ken is up in the "a bit weird" department.
Oh, btw, Meowser the only reason I am sensitive to the spelling of that word is that my email has automatic spellcheck and it's quite shocking how often I need to use variations of embarrass when describing my doings.
Put me down for guessing Ken is a country boy who is so far in the closet even he doesn't realize it-that explains his superficial sexual advances toward women and his relatively egalitarian relationship with Peggy.
He's the last one who will ever realize he's gay–until then he'll drift and not have relationships with women. Sal is more tuned in even if he's closeted–that explains the line.
Ken may even marry somebody after a whirlwind courtship.
I'm surprised no one considered that Ken could be bisexual.
Barring that, I think he does have that 'new single' attitude as represented by Playboy and Esquire — a man who doesn't feel the need to get married or even go steady for any other reasons but his own.
I think Ken is a bit of a free spirit. He tends to say what he's thinking, and it seems he would probably enjoy being a 'playboy' by going stag. At some point, I hope Matt finds him a girlfriend.
No; I don't get gay/bisex vibe from Ken. As another poster saliently pointed out, if Ken were gay he would be the first one with a date. Notice how even Sal is married. Also, remember Ken's throw away line to Don when Don got back, "Kurt's a homo." Ken is one of the very few decent characters on MM (if a shade obtuse). I think he is ripe for character development…I can't wait to see where it goes.
Even if Ken is a "country boy" or a free spirit, or bisexual, still, in 1963 he would have brought a date to a formal social event.
Hell, what I said about my parents, my life had nothing to do with country clubs, we were lower middle class, as was our community.
Where anything approaching a formal event, required a "date" of some sort. No pressure on romance or especially sex, but a couple. Seating would be arranged for couples, and no hostess wanted a "hole" in her table.
It's a gaffe and an anachronism, but one made by Mad Men writers to make some sort of point of their own. If only to give him the line about bringing a date next time.
I’m sorry foe the typos. I’m doing this on a handheld because I’ve moved recently and don’t have internet access yet. But that’s enough about me. I agree with the comment that Ken is enjoying the Playboy life. In many ways, Ken reminds me of a young Roger, cocky, self-assured, all about the chase. I think the only reason Roger married was because it was what you did. Someone in his position needed a wife. Ken seems pretty easy going. Any woman would be lucky to marry him. I think Ken going stag was there to highlight the importance of not just a wife, but the right kind of wife. Harry will not get raises based on Jennifer, but he will suceed due to talent. Perhaps the same is true for Ken. I had never thought about it until I read the comments, but now I wonder, did Ken go stag because he wanted to, or because he didn’t know better. Either answer reveals a great deal about who he is
I’m absolutely fascinated by this thread. So far, Ken is a cipher; I hope he’s developed more in the future, so we can answer the questions.
He’s definitely sensitive (the short stories, the Rothko reaction) and easy-going. It had crossed my mind that he could possibly, maybe unconsciously be bi-sexual in season two; but for the life of me I can’t believe he didn’t bring a date to the country club. At this point, I just think he represents the younger generation while the Governor’s aide represents the older. And it may have been a wee anachronistic for the writers to do this. We’ll see…
Do you know who's really a cipher? Joan. For someone who's one of the main characters, we know next to nothing about her past, her background, her family, etc. Literally nothing! Are her parents alive or dead? Did she go to college? Where is she from? I hope her story is delved into this season, I want to know how she got to be who she is. What fire forged her steel?
We at least know Ken is from…Vermont was it? Somewhere with maple trees.
Oh and Ken's mother is heavy. So we can assume she's alive, he said, I think, that she IS heavyset, not that she was. Loved that line, btw, made me feel a lot fonder of ol' lunchtime fondler Ken.
Great post, Joyce. I agree about Joan and I've been thinking about her background, as well. I just thought about Ken at the Country club again, and why he didn't bring a date. I'm going to revise my post. If MW said that Ken represents the "writer," then it makes sense that he hangs back and observes. Did Nick Carroway bring a date in his initial visit to Gatsby's? I think in the future, we will continue to see Ken hang back and observe in some scenes.
Lurker.
Put me down for thinking Ken is having an affair with one of the wives.
I don't remember names, but specifically the one that split away from the trio as they were watching Pete & Trudy dance.
Ken's wild, all right.
Oh wait, right, Joan met Carol in college. I don’t think we ever heard where though or anything about her past. I’m very curious. Where did she pick up the accordion? High school music class?
Great points about Joan, Joyce; I’ve been wondering about her, too. So much of her seems to be a carefully crafted image. I wonder if her age is the only thing she doesn’t want the world to know.
I just keep thinking about her line about food near a bed reminding her of a hospital. Huh? And she’s SO SO SO confident, at a relatively young age — how did she get that way?
Watching old episodes and still slightly frustrated at Ken being so unphased by everything around him. I understand that he is the writer, etc. However, he had much more of a part in story and plot development in previous seasons. Now he just has banal lines constantly wishing he were a part of things(this week he wanted to be a part of the Jai Alai extravaganza)…although with Mad Men there could be a very good reason for this.
Don't know why, but I just adore Ken…just re-watched episode 5 of last season(to try and speculate on ep 5 events of this season) and I still love the 'I'm Ken' reaction he gave Jane. As if to say, 'How can you not know who I am?'
Anyway, completely agree about Joan's backstory.
"And she’s SO SO SO confident, at a relatively young age — how did she get that way?"
And, Joyce, it's especially awe-inspiring for the 40's and 50's(her formative years) when women had very specific roles that they were not to veer from. Maybe her folks were 'show people' as they use to say in olden times(I am so replacing 'back in the day' with that phrase in all my conversations)