This is our plan for show nights, folks. Open thread for everyone to comment live (especially during commercials), so that we can all chat as things happen. This thread will go up nine p.m. Eastern time so we can start pre-chatting. Western time viewers beware of spoilers!
For the premier tonight, we’re at Roberta’s place with Progrrl from Galactica Sitrep and zeitgeist from Whedonesque and our friend Al who isn’t from a show blog.
So, comment away!
165 Responses to “Open Thread: For Those Who Think Young”
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It's hard. We're sort of breathless.
Less than 30 minutes…
oh, how i envy y'all…we're tv-less here, and i've depended on alternate
means to see mad men (pre-DVD, of course)…
any word as to when the new episode will be available through itunes or amazon unbox?
Ooh, I'm here with remote and vodka gimlet in hand!
we have no words.
Less than 15 minutes…. aaakk!!!
Haters! Wait… Sitting here with the awesome Sisters Lipp and the infamous Proggrrl waiting to watch the Season Premiere. Countdown…
Aaarrrgh. I so wish I had an east coast feed!
Last season on Mad Men…
That promo was awesome.
Eeeeee! It's on! I just spilled some of my anachronistic Tanqueray Rangpur and tonic running to the TV.
At last at last.
I see Betty has her horses already.
Where's Peggy?
Don eats a lot of apples…
"A *printer*?!" *gasp* "How does it work?" "Is it dangerous?"
I hear it eats people! Its already demanding its own office
Wha? Okay, Peggy Corleone…dial it down a bit.
Sorry we're late!
You guys will want to look at this later:
Meditations On An Emergency
by Frank O'Hara
Reference One
<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=nPOa58RyG3EC&dq=mediations+o+an+emergency+o%27hara&pg=PP1&ots=O5j33LPmoA&sig=TSjHEvzVGTttfRKoYj_zSreVamQ&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=1&ct=result" rel="nofollow">Reference Two
<a href="http://www.amazon.com/Meditations-Emergency-Frank-OHara/dp/0802134521" rel="nofollow">Reference Three
"And how do you know that…?"
I guess this is with limited commercial interruption?
I love Mad Men b/c it's so educational… now I know the 1960's synonym for call girl!
Seems pretty limited so far
Fine by me!
Well, well, look who's got the 60s flip! That's what it's called right?
Uh oh, this isn't going well.
The daughter was pregnant? – Pete
Their bed's bigger at home. Tuftier.
Jackie, she's so 'That Girl'.
What the? Is your tongue soft too, Don? Get to work!
It's the bp meds. Makes a boy all flaccid.
Not a printer, a copy machine! And gossip about Peg's weight loss. And hey, not only bp meds, but phenobarb, which is HELLO, strong.
Or blood ice cream… wait…
Two new young boys interviewing… "Are you married?"
"Fool! Didn't you see Episode 2? Don't you know crying is only allowed in the Ladies' Room?!"
Oh, that's phone operator Lois as Don's new secretary. Good for her.
Maybe good for her. Doesn't seem to be going all that well.
Is "share an office" a euphemism? It should be…
"I mean theoretically, if you were to get pregnant with my demon spawn, would you want to have kids?" – Imaginary Pete
Monkey crap!!!
Hmm… I wonder if Peggy will become the type of brunette Don wants to sleep with?
Oooh, look at Don all respectful of women.
Betty, have you not seen any horror movies?
Is this our promised African-American character?
Honestly, the way Betty "drives", I'm a little worried about her driving living creatures like horses…
For six dollars, really Betty? He's kind of hot, but come on! I resist banging the hot Domino's guy.
Who is that tow truck guy? He looks really familiar.
It's so Betty though, to be trying on all sorts of hats in a way, testing her own boundaries and sort of deforming her own personality to try to learn about things she doesn't understand or that seem foreign or exciting to her. IMO. Eventually she'll take it too far and it'll get out of hand/control. Le sigh…
I don't know if I like these "artsy" bits…
Only one commercial, and only a minute, and it was SO DENSE!
Are we all agreed that he was mailing the book to Rachel? I mean, who else could it be?
Oh, what a wonderful poem – I'm so glad they incorporated it into the premiere:
http://www.palace.net/~llama/poetry/emermed
Key line of the night: When Don said he felt "uninvolved." Definitely.
okay…was able to watch some remotely over skype on my parents' tv…didn't catch if we were able to see to whom don addressed _meditations in an emergency_….rachel? midge?
didn't catch if we were able to see to whom don addressed _meditations in an emergency
No, they didn't show the address.
Mel, definitely Rachel as far as I'm concerned. He was walking the dog; you know, the big dog he bought for his daughter right after Rachel told him how important big dogs were to a young girl? That dog? Yeah.
*Matt Weiner is Officially a God*
I loved the few commericals. It'd be great if all the episodes were like that.
And I immediately thought the book was for Rachel.
Darn it, didn't know about this thread.
Lessee… I soooooo knew Pete and Trudy would be childless. Knew it!!
Line of the night… Sal: Where's her husband.
Yes, Betty — you could have been a hell of a party girl.
Look at Don coming home to his wife, and she's the one who isn't home! Does this mean they discussed the infidelities?
They want us to think the package is for Rachel — is it?
Joan totally got revenge on Peggy for being too uppity and not thinking of the girls.
Loved Betty's Valentine's Day dress.
**What the? Is your tongue soft too, Don? Get to work!**
I take it back — THAT'S the line of the night!
I bet Don mailed the book to Midge. Was it just me or did anyone else notice the fingerprints the mechanic left on the dusty front of the hood of the car after he installed the fan belt…."Betty, you got some 'splainin' to do…." (use your best Ricky Ricardo impersonation). Wonder if Don will notice eventually?
Thanks, Ms. Darkly. I have no idea why I'm still single…
Lisa, they seemed to make a real point of the hand prints, which means it'll either figure in to the plot or that it was symbolic. I'm leaning towards the former.
I love the ending, the poem, it's as if Don is wondering where his magic touch has gone, and when it's coming back.
Let me just say right now that I am so glad to have Mad Men back for Season 2. It was so worth the wait. I loved the episode! Lots of great moments. I was so glad to see Peggy becoming "one of the guys" at the board meetings and she's is definitely fantastic. She's full of ideas and she's not afraid to pitch it to the guys. The whole Xerox copy machine scenes were just as cool. Having Joan decide at different moments in the episode about where to place the Xerox was priceless.
This is going to be a fantastic season! Welcome back Mad Men!!!
Betty needs a whip, that black bustier ensemble is very Betty Page
Too bad Pete wasn't there for Peggy's "daddy" talk — I think he might have liked it.
Our very own B. Cooper got a question in to Matt Weiner!!!!!!!!!!!
Mrs. Sal is fiiiine, then again I guess she has him to style her.
I can't get into MW chat — I imagine there will be a transcript. Congrats, B!
The official AMC Mad Men site is slow for me right now.
Favorite line of the episode: "Fat farm! I thought we had a verification!" Also, I like that Betty says all the wrong things when faced with Don's equipment failure. Jackie's point is well taken, of course; but whatever you do, don't keep bringing it up. That never works.
**Betty needs a whip, that black bustier ensemble is very Betty Page**
Definetly; and during the riding scene at the stable, Betty's also looking very Tippi Hedren in Marnie – subtle nod to Hitchcock for sure from Matt and the writers. I nearly fell over when Betty reminds her daughter that riding is dangerous and reminds her of the daughter in Gone With The Wind – whoa, put some money aside to send your kid to therapy in a few years!!
Also, I don't think that Don sent the book to Rachel. I think that's the obvious choice, and Matt W. is going for the headfake on this one.
Betty's daughter is definitely heading to therapy in a few years!
Sally doesn't stand a chance for a normal childhood with Mommy Dearest !
Betty wants Sally to be perfect in every way. Remember last year (Shoot) when she was messing with her hair to fix it better while Sally was trying to eat breakfast!
I can't help but think that the meditation book would be more in line with Midge but that's just a guess. I'm just basing it on her beatnik lifestyle. I could be way off base.
Trudy's hairdo was very "That Girl" but that show didn't come on until 1966. That flip did start getting popular in the early 60's though, Marlo Thomas just perfected it.
Betty looked stunning coming down that elegant staircase. Very "made every head in the place turn" kind of entrance.
Did I hear right that the dr. acknowledged that Don said he was cutting down his 2 pack a day cigarette habit? Has Don finally decided that maybe smoking isn't that great for your health?
Peggy was a tad harsh with poor Lois but I'm sure that although Peggy loves her promotion, she still feels that she still knows the best way to handle a Draper situation. I do hope Lois stays. I like her.
Wonder if we will find out who the lovely lady is that Salvatore was with during the Jackie Kennedy tour. I think I remember my mother watching that back in '62. Yes, I'm an old person, born in '55.
I didn't quite catch who the lady was that Betty was chatting with at the top of the show after her ride. Can someone clarify that for me, please?
I don't think he sent the book to Rachel. i think he walked away from her when he saw he was in Love with that guy. I think it goes deeper something to do with his child hood
**I didn’t quite catch who the lady was that Betty was chatting with at the top of the show after her ride. Can someone clarify that for me, please?**
As far as I can tell, she's a new friend. I didn't catch her name.
i also think don sent the book to midge. o'hara is much more midge's vibe…also, i think don is looking for reaffirmation of his manhood, and who better to grant that than the longtime mistress/lust connection?
anyway, things ended with rachel on a humiliating note for don, and i can't see him in his state taking such a risk with rachel…
Lisa J, Rose — Oh yeah, poor Sally is going to have "issues". Remember how Betty mentioned Sally was looking "fat" in season one, just like she told her psychiatrist her mother used to say about her? (I believe the word Betty's mother used was "stout".)
Yeah right. That Sally's a tub o' lard! (o:
**I don’t think he sent the book to Rachel. i think he walked away from her when he saw he was in Love with that guy. I think it goes deeper something to do with his child hood**
Mike–
Midge was the one in love with another man. Rachel is the woman from the department story who went on a cruise when it became clear that Don was willing to skip out on his family.
**Did I hear right that the dr. acknowledged that Don said he was cutting down his 2 pack a day cigarette habit? Has Don finally decided that maybe smoking isn’t that great for your health?**
Jan W,
I took it to me more the doctor's cynical recitation of what he hears all day in his office. Kinda like a prison guard looking at an inmate and saying, "I know, you're innocent."
Looks like nobody picked up that that was Sal's WIFE in the scene!
I think a number of commenters already knew, actually; that was accidentally revealed well before the season began.
My first thought on the book was that Don was sending it to Midge, but then I thought…maybe to the young new talent that Duck wants Don to hire? Don is shrewd enough to know that you can't appear to be outmaneuvered (as Pete says, "No one makes Don Draper do anything", taking us back to Season 1 when Don is forced to re-hire Campbell but Sterling plays it off like it was Don's idea), so maybe he's decided to get behind the idea rather than be left behind.
I personally love the fashion in this show, and watch each new secene for the fabulous outfits!
Okay – does anyone think if Betty was more "talented" in the sack, maybe Don would be more into her and not have the women on the side? Or would he flip out – shocked that the mother of his children is reading Cosmo on the sly and has skills? If Betty was a former roommate of the party girl, she must have a clue; even the most sheltered woman talks to her girlfriends, everyone compares notes. Don's always very lusty with his other conquests, after Betty comes down the stairs at the Savoy, he kisses her on the cheek?? Thoughts……??
From the AMC episode recap: "…At home, Sal and his wife view the White House tour. "
Did not know Sal's marriage had been revealed B4. Thx.
Yeah, some of the pics for season 2 that were released a while back showed Sal's ring.
I'm guessing Betty isn't all that freaky, but I also get the idea she has a high sex drive and is "open" to suggestions. I'm blaming Don if she's not doing the things he likes.
I'm with Ms. Darkly; I don't think that's a valid excuse for adultery in any case, but there's no lack of enthusiasm on the Betty Draper front, as we saw in "Indian Summer". Don is looking for another kind of woman, and he's already determined what kind of woman Betty is.
I'm with you Ms. Darkly, Don IS to blame, he's such a cold fish with her when it comes to affection and intimacy. I can't help but think Betty may eventually venture into an adulterous relationship herself; she let the young a/c salesman into the house last season, tonight pushing the envelope with the mechanic, some day she may not be able to fight a guy off, or she may just go out to have an affair to see what it's like; she's very childish and craves attention in the worst way.
This blog is truly THE best!
I depend on you for my “fix.”
I can’t believe it is finally here!!!!
Breathe …..
Maybe it's a little like the cliche, "Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?" Only with Don it's, "You kiss our children with that mouth — it can't go there… or there." Or maybe he's afraid it will seem common or inappropriate.
It's clear Don has issues with women and motherhood.
Betty is her own person, reaching the peak of her sex drive, and she has needs, and some of those needs might be more than the missionary position.
We're about a decade away from Nancy Friday publishing My Secret Garden which was an anthology of women's sexual fantasies. At the time it was ground-breaking for someone to say, "Women think about sex, group sex, interracial sex, freaky sex, sex in different positions… sex in just about any configuration you can imagine."
Betty's sexuality doesn't really have a voice yet. She can tell her husband she wants him all the time (Babylon), but she might not be allowed to tell him explicitly how she wants him, where she wants him. She might not be able to use the word that appears a lot in Lady Chatterly's Lover, or any other naughty words. I bet Midge used those words though.
Does anyone know what the guys in the elevator were talking about? I couldn't understand parts of it, I just grasped that they were being crude. What are the chances that Peggy kept the baby? I thought I read somewhere that she kept it, but then I read tonight that she probably gave it up for adoption.
flyme2themoon:
They were talking about a woman, maybe the secretary of the man they were trying to sell some insurance. The one said he'd gotten her drunk, essentially to loosen her up, that she was wearing days of the week panties, and that said panties were soaked through, and that once she got started she was wild.
Yeah, I watched it a third time just now and finally got it, it was hard to hear. Probably not all that nice anyway, ha! Any thoughts on Peggy's baby? Oh, if Pete only knew he already has a kid out there. And there he is, asking Peggy if she wants kids, ha!
I know! I figure her family will be blaming him, and poor Pete's swimmers are just fine!
No ideas on the child.
Her family referring to Trudy. Yikes.
I want you kidz to know, as someone that works in advertising right now…that everything Duck and Roger were saying about Talent? Still completely, depressingly true.
Sigh.
I'm sorry guys, please don't whack me on the head but I was really disappointed in tonight's episode. I mean, c'mon. There's a giant lapse in time and everyone is just floundering. Don/Dick and Betty are still together but when we left off last season, they were heading for the skids. Peggy had just given birth, Roger had just had this major heart attack, whats-his-name was begging his wife to take him back, etc. And then bam! Jump forward 14 months??? What the heck?
Season 2 opener starts and everything is different. It's as if the whole story line slipped into a coma with all characters in tow. And now, after over a year everyone is still sluggish and the story has suddenly become sentimental and preachy. Ugh! I feel like I'm watching Thirtysomething for the new mellinium. I'm sad now.
This is beautiful, I’m so glad they chose this piece for the premier: http://www.palace.net/~llama/poetry/emermed
I think the book is a red herring. We'll probably get a scene showing both Midge and Rachel with the book, but we'll have to guess which one received it in the mail. Or maybe it's meant for someone we haven't been introduced to yet.
Hey all, i know i haven’t written here in a while, but i plan to be more active now that the second season has begun.
Oh, and Mattthew Weiner answered my question! mine was the one before Roberta’s!
FYI – the first episode of season 2 is now avail on itunes – mine is downloading as I type!!
I certainly didn’t love this episode as much as I did last year’s premiere. It seemed like it was trying to do too much–maybe it was a little disjointed? The characters, too caustic? I don’t know. And I can say that I definitely do NOT like the sad, good husband Don. Please, someone find him a feisty brunette, but quick. I want my old Don back.
1960: The Xerox 914 Copier Becomes an Instant Hit. From (a href="http://blogs.ebay.com/xcopiers/entry/History-of-Xerox/_W0QQidZ535100011">History of Xerox, I ran a copy shop in the 60's and we had one of these in the customer lobby for 4 cents a copy on plain paper. Wow, that makes my back hurt. It was a dog of a machine…
Oooops. History of Xerox description of the amazing machine that started an avalanche of anonymous butt-shot notes to bosses, starting in 1960…
I feel sorry for Lois. I assumed if Sal were going to be stuck in a loveless travesty of a marriage, it would be with her. But maybe he needed an Italian wife to make his mama happy. Sigh…
As for the book, I’m assuming it’s for Rachel. She’s Don’s unrequited love, and let’s face it, the only love that lasts is the unrequited kind!
Slept on it, read the messages (wish I could stay up and post longer, but I have a long morning commute and have to get up at dawn), and I still think that Don was mailing the book to Rachel. In Don's view, Midge was there for carefree sex, fun banter, and all things un-serious, not to discuss his private feelings or share poetry that reflected them.
Scene that truly revealed the depth of Don's disconnection: the first meeting with the group. Don goes into his Don Draper routine, summing up what it is that advertising is really selling, the group listens as raptly as if it was the Sermon On The Mount… and Don trails off with "blah, blah, blah, blah." He can't even sustain belief in his own spiel.
The other thing that struck me was the Peggy/Don relationship. Her fealty to him appears complete and uncompromising. Not just her dressing down poor secretary Lois, but her entire attitude around him. She still calls him "Mr. Draper," probably would no more call him "Don" than Luca Brasi would call Don Corleone "Vito." Clearly she knows how much she owes him, appreciates that he treats her as a professional (the attitude of the others really hasn't changed much. They don't trouble to censor their comments around her, and still treat her like a secretary: "Go see where he is."), and is determined to not let him down. On Don's side, he clearly expects a lot from her, and shows it. The one glimpse we had of the old Don was when he was telling her what her ad needed. No "blah blah blah blah" added on the end of that.
Look, someone said it upthread… it was a weird episode. Its strength relied more on leaving us wanting more than on satisfying any real itches (except for, thank god we're watching a new episode!) I really wonder what new viewers, people who didn't see Season One, will think of it. As a single episode of television, it doesn't stand alone the way that the pilot or some of the S1 episodes did.
This is not to say that I'm disappointed. It's great setup for what I have been continually predicting will be a knockout season. I cannot wait to see what comes out of it.
It was totally setup for the rest of Season Two and its going to be a wild ride!
A good Don is a boring Don! This man coming home on time and being with the kids is lame. It's even boring him so much that he can't get it up! Some independent hot brunette needs to hurry the hell up and work Don into a frenzy!!
No such thing as a boring Don
Its his pharmaceutical cocktail thats caging the rabid beast that is is libido.
Got that right, goooooooooo Don. Totally great episode!
This married Sal thing was the big shocker to me, and I agree with most of you that Don sent the book to Rachel. I wonder if Don realizes that the author was an opengly gay poet back in the day?
Two Anachronisms:
1. Don says, "blah, blah, blah…" They might have said that back then, but it comes off as too '00s.
2. Betty says to the daughter, about riding horses, something to the effect of "don't you remember what happened in 'Gone With the Wind'?"
GWTW hadn't been shown on TV in 1962. Did they bring a little girl to a revival house in Manhattan to see a 4-hour movie? Think not.
Hey! Love your blog. I have a few thoughts on this episode. Did I hear the boys in the boardroom say that Peggy had been away for a couple of months? Perhaps she confided her situation in Don, as her boss, and he allowed her to take the time off. I can't see her being allowed to just disappear unexplained for a period of time without being fired. This could explain her fierce loyalty to Don in the face of a fairly benign comment by Lois. Don might have "verified" the fat farm story to Pete to end speculation about her absence. It would provide a neat little juxtaposition if Don now knows a secret about Pete that Pete doesn't even know. Maybe she didn't say who the father is, but certainly, Peggy's loyalty is without question. As Bert Cooper said, "One never knows how loyalty is born."
the song when Betty walks down the stairs was gorgeous!
(i believe is was in the closing as well)
etymology of blah
blah (n.)
"idle, meaningless talk," 1918, probably echoic; the adj. meaning "bland, dull" is from 1919, perhaps infl. by Fr. blasé "bored, indifferent." The blahs "depression" is first attested 1969.
Patti, very interesting speculation.
Yeah, interesting and a really fitting theory. Especially in light of Don and Peggy's mentoring relationship. Very interesting indeed.
Perhaps she confided her situation in Don, as her boss, and he allowed her to take the time off. I can’t see her being allowed to just disappear unexplained for a period of time without being fired. This could explain her fierce loyalty to Don in the face of a fairly benign comment by Lois. Don might have “verified†the fat farm story to Pete to end speculation about her absence. It would provide a neat little juxtaposition if Don now knows a secret about Pete that Pete doesn’t even know. Maybe she didn’t say who the father is, but certainly, Peggy’s loyalty is without question. As Bert Cooper said, “One never knows how loyalty is born.â€
I like this! Add onto it Don's personal history as the child of a woman who couldn't raise him, and the psychology of his wanting to help Peggy becomes fascinating, compensating, consciously or not, for what happened to his birth mother.
After seeing the Season 1 finale for the first time on Saturday, this was a bit of a let down. No revelations or fireworks, just back to business. I understand they wanted to bring the audience up to speed after the time lapse, but that's about all they did. After the turmoil of that final episode it was a bit jarring.
I hate when people give episodes like this pass as "setting up for the rest of the season". "The Sopranos" fell into that trap in the last few seasons, and seldom delivered on the promise.
I also agree that Dondick sent the book to someone from his past that we haven't been introduced to yet. But I really hope he doesn't turn into a goody two shoes, because that's not what I tune in for.
I had to look up the history of the remote control, after seeing Dondick change the channel from the hotel bed (personally, we didn't have them in my house until the mid 80s, but Zenith had an ultrasonic version in use in 1956). I'm actually learning stuff watching this show–who knew?
I don't think it's just setting up for the new season, it's hinting at what happened since we've been gone. People aren't in turmoil over the events of The Wheel, because life has gone on — but we still need to know what happened, and that will also be found in the upcoming episode.
I'm not giving it a free pass, I agree it was jarring, and that I would have liked seeing some more fireworks, but I also look forward to having some of the blanks filled in.
The episode is playing while I sit here — I love how Betty is clueless that her ex-roomie is a call girl, but when she tells Francine about it later, she acts very in the know.
Roger really wants to roam those hills again, and it could be the death of him.
I love how Betty smiles when Gertie calls her a good girl.
I like the kind of candy with a chart in the box, too.
Did Pete call Trudy "Tweetie?" Another bird reference?
Joel Murray/Freddie is now added to the opening credits — home run, Mr. Murray.
Bwhaa, sorry, the way Peggy says. "We have artwork," and smirks. Love it! Especially on the heels of being expected to know how many glasses they have.
I really wonder what new viewers, people who didn’t see Season One, will think of it. As a single episode of television, it doesn’t stand alone the way that the pilot or some of the S1 episodes did.
Roberta, I agree wholeheartedly. This episode did not have any of the magic of the S1 episodes. I can't imagine a new viewer glomming onto this show solely based on what they saw last night. The stories were too disjointed, and despite criticism over nothing happening, I felt there was way too much going on–too much to follow, and too many characters to try to remember. It felt…muddled to me–like they tried to accomplish too much with the hour that they had. Betty's story arc alone had 11 or 12 characters in it. Then when you add all the Sterling Cooper people and take into count the home lives of Joan, Pete and Salvatore, plus Don's visit to the Doctor and the bar, there were way too many people in this episode. The main characters' stories seemed diffused because of all the incidental characters who had far too much to do.
Perhaps she confided her situation in Don, as her boss, and he allowed her to take the time off.
Patti, I think this is excellent speculation. In 1960, Peggy was "the new girl." She hadn't even been on the job for a year, but they gave her a couple months off, and then allowed her to resume her new position after she returned? You don't even get a week's vacation until you've been on the job for a year. I'm sure she let Don in on her "secret."
Regarding the book…it seems too obvious to go to either Midge or Rachel. But maybe Weiner's going to do the same thing with that storyline as he did with Peggy's pregnancy: hide it in plain sight. For example, maybe there'll be a scene at Midge's where we see the book on the coffee table, and we think, oh, he sent it to her, but then find out much later in the season that Midge's book doesn't contain Don's inscription.
A few notes on last night's episode:
Not disappointed. Don's acting exactly as a man with a broken heart would act, now or in any other time. And he's even more inside his own head than he was before (perhaps because he's got nowhere else to go). I appreciate both the writing and his acting: his shambled state came through loud and clear.
"Gone With the Wind" was a book before it was a movie. Betty's exactly the kind of woman who might have shared the story of that book with her daughter — and remind her of the danger inherent in horseback riding, not the fun.
Is Sal married? Really? If he'd married Lois, wouldn't she be home now, being all wifey? I must believe they are just dating. I must continue to see a glimmer of hope for poor closeted Salvatore (and for Lois, of course). Each deserves better.
Peggy the Powerful: you *go*, Mouse Ears! Push it all waaaay down, zip it up, hide it. And don't let the copy machine in your office get you down. You are the future (of 14-hour days and unequal pay). Don't ever forget it.
Inside scoop: that "party girl" in Episode 1 is the new Mrs. Gavin Newsom; she just married the mayor of our fair city of San Francisco over the weekend. Movin' on up, that Juanita! For those not in the know, the new Mrs. Mayor is a lightly educated clotheshorse who is none too kind on the subject of her new husband's past girlfriends.
LOVE this blog. Beats the AMC thing hands down. You're all funnier, for one thing. For another … it's just a sweeter spot.
Welcome, Anne B!
It's definite that Sal is married, tragic though that is. The woman in that scene is credited as Kitty Romano.
JeCoupe — my parents and older siblings brought my to many lengthy movies, even grown-up ones, when I was Sally's age or younger.
Also, my mom read me great novels (leaving out racy parts!), as well as kids' tales, for bedtime stories. Betty may have read or told Sally the GWTW story.
———-
I hate when people give episodes like this pass as “setting up for the rest of the seasonâ€. “The Sopranos†fell into that trap in the last few seasons, and seldom delivered on the promise."
———-
Hate it all you want! I don't think any of us are giving it a free pass, we just expect that this is setting up the rest of the season (which it seems to do quite well). If it doesn't pay it off, then I'm sure that we can all bitch about it later, but I think its too soon to call foul on an episode that can't possibly satisfy everyone's every desire. Mad Men != (that's does not equal) Sopranos. Until proven otherwise, I'm giving it the benefit of the doubt.
Don is not a boring character no matter how well or ill behaved he is. If you're tuning in only for him to act like a mail-order male whore, you just may be watching the wrong program, IMO. I expect him to grow over time, wherever that leads him. My only disappointment will be if he ends up behaving exactly as in S1 in SX, X being whenever things wind down.
I just hope that Matt doesn't open some story lines and never address them again (i.e. the Russian in "Pine Barren") like they did on Sopranos.
Got forbid, we never here about Peggy's baby again, or we are to assume that she just gave it away for adoption. He is probably with her parents.
I just can't believe that Pete is so dim that he never put's togethr the idea that Peggy might have had a baby (sudden weight loss) and he had been sleeping with her t the time. I gave him credit for a little more smarts. He's sleazy, but smart at times.
Ellelque,
Exactly — what a "maroon."
I have a small hope, very small, that he has considered it and that's why he asked Peggy if she wants to have kids, his eyes did flicker over her body.
One interesting twist in the future. Peggy's parents pass or something else happens where she has to bring Pete Jr. to live with her. She may pass him off as her nephew. But Matt can hire a 2 year old who is the spitting image of Pete. Say the nanny has to bring Pete Jr. to the office?
Quick question that has always plagued me. Remember when Pete punch Cosgrove when he made that nasty comment about Peggy in the last season? How come none of the guys questioned that "out of character" action of Pete? Did anyone put 1+1 together? I mean how dumb are these guys. I credit Paul for some brains.
If I make a typing error, it's cause my mind works faster than my hands. LOL
I am just spit balling how we can get Pete to find out. It should be very climactic. The look on his face!!
Does anyone else think that Jackie Kennedy's voice was very "transvestic". I couldn't help but think that when I was listening to it. I am such a bad American!
Ellelque, I was surprised at how deep her voice was.
Zeitgeist, the pilot did a fantastic job of of setting up the season while still being a perfect self-contained episode. Each episode has been like its own little movie. I don't think For Those Who Think Young was a perfect standalone episode. I'm excited about season 2 and it was beautifully written and acted, but it wasn't beautifully constructed.
@zeitgeist: No, I didn't *hate* the ep. I thought it was well done but, as someone else here said, it just seemed "muddled". It certainly didn't have any of the *zing* of the previous season's episodes; it seemed weighed down by its own conventions. Sometimes this show is derailed by its own cleverness–but that's just my opinion, of course.
And when I said I didn't want Dondick to change that was tongue-in-cheek–of course I understand the main protagonist has to go through some "transformation" in a show like this for it to succeed. But why does it have to be the booze and broads that are the first to go?
(If you knew me personally, you'd realize that I'm much more sarcastic than comes across on the internet.)
I enjoyed last night's season two premiere, but was also mildly disappointed and felt it was not up to the standards set by almost every episode of season one. My favorite line was when (I thnk) the Jackie O tour was about to cut to a commercial, saying "….and now a word from our sponsor," and AMC did the same. Funny. My favorite scene was the standoff between Don and Roger, where the latter ultimately tells him he HAS to hire some new blood. There were a number of good lines, Betty looked absolutely luminous and is sexier than ever, and overall it was definitely quality television — but all that said, it also felt overstuffed and unresolved; if this was the big comeback episode to suck in a ton of new viewers, they blew it.
Hee! I just had posted on another thread here the other day that there was a serious lack of coffee at SC, going by modern standards. They drink booze all day but coffee must have been limited to meals and after dinner.
The relationship between Don and Betty in this episode reminded me of Grace Kelly and Jimmy Stewart in Rear Window. Grace Kelly is the beautiful model who wants to get married and have a traditional life. Jimmy Stewart resists being tied down and losing his freedom until he sees that she has an adventurous side and can be a companion in the adventure of life. When Betty comes down the staircase in the hotel lounge, she is everyman's dream of the ideal woman and Don's face reflects that he's fallen for the dream ( similar to when Jimmy Stewart wakes up to find Grace Kelly face right in front of him). But Don knows deep down that the idealized woman is not enough to satisfy him because she's not real. Betty is too inhibited in her marriage, like many women in the 60s, and her inhibitions affect her physically as well as psychologically. In this episode she is beginning to find a way to express herself (horseback riding, the vignette with the towtruck man). Don has succumbed to being the loyal husband (at least he's trying), but he knows it isn't satisfying; hence, the book and the reminder of his past love.
lingua franca, nice take on what is probably my favorite film of all time. Grace Kelly's entrance in that film — silent, luminous, from out of focus to in-focus, her first act a kiss — will never be equaled.
But Betty has changed since we last saw her. Then, she thought she could "be happy if my husband was faithful to me." Now I think she's seeing that this is not exactly the case.
Betty may have no clear idea, even now, of how distressed (even angry?) she is. She'll get a clue soon enough.
Either way, Don is not really what she wants any more. Don and Betty were an interesting study last night: two very attractive people, gamely trying to make their marriage work, who seem to be trying to focus on each other and not quite succeeding.
Jackie, I think Roger Sterling said something about the last cup of coffee one of the creatives had drunk. It was the fifth he'd been given after a night of drinking — or something like that. So in 1962, is coffee still the old guy's sober-up drink, in a time when no one wants to lose the buzz?
Makes me wonder how Starbucks did it …
"Zeitgeist, the pilot did a fantastic job of of setting up the season while still being a perfect self-contained episode. Each episode has been like its own little movie. I don’t think For Those Who Think Young was a perfect standalone episode. I’m excited about season 2 and it was beautifully written and acted, but it wasn’t beautifully constructed."
@Deb – right, but the pilot had no choice. The premiere of the second season is under additional constraints, being the middle child that's trying to bridge S1 and S2. S1E1 had no baggage at all, so I don't think its all that fair to compare.
"@zeitgeist: No, I didn’t *hate* the ep. I thought it was well done but, as someone else here said, it just seemed “muddledâ€. It certainly didn’t have any of the *zing* of the previous season’s episodes; it seemed weighed down by its own conventions. Sometimes this show is derailed by its own cleverness–but that’s just my opinion, of course… But why does it have to be the booze and broads that are the first to go?"
@Jeff K
Gotcha, totally misread you. Didn't mean "hate the ep", btw, meant feel free to hate away at the idea of folks giving it a free ride, which they totally shouldn't do. I would agree that it could and maybe does get derailed by its own cleverness at times and you win with the "booze and broads" line
)
I had also theorized that Don knew what happened to Peggy and that's why their relationship is the way it is now. He is very much her mentor, and she is really defensive of him. Almost father/daughter. I thought I saw a preview in the past few weeks where Don made a comment to Pete – something like "at least you can't knock me up" – I wish I could remember it better, but to me it seemed that it was a hint he knew Pete was the father of Peggy's baby. Which I'm sure would make him dislike Pete all the more than he already does, even if Pete doesn't know anything about the situation. The preview could have just been a cobbled together confection to make the viewer think Don knew what had happened, but I am wondering if anyone else might have seen it and got the same impression.
I too thought this wasn't the most outstanding episode, maybe we are just expecting so much because we haven't seen a new episode in so long! It had the great references to vintage items that I think all of us love though, I have also learned things just from watching the show. Like the bit with the remote, I noticed it too and thought, that seems a little advanced for the time – but you can pretty much count on it, if it's in the show, then it's probably accurate. Oh yeah, Jackie Kennedy's voice. I remember the first time I saw a clip of that White House tour and I thought she had such a strange voice. My mom just loved Jackie back in the day, she never even thought her voice was weird. I still think it is. She smoked like a chimney btw, I'm sure most people know that now. She fit right in with the rest of the characters on MM!
Did anyone see the previews for next week? They show Pete coming out of his office, looking very freaked. Hildy asking "Is anything wrong Mr. Campbell. Maybe he finds out about his son? Although a lot could happen to freak him out. Also they show Duck and him getting along. I think Duck is going to be a good ally for Pete. I think Don is going to regret hiring him.
They say that Jackie's smoking is what made her have the miscarrage on her third baby.
Ellelque
I think what freaks Pete out is something else — I don't want to do a spoiler, but think there is going to be an event that will freak out a lot of people.
Anne B.
The drunk that they give coffee to is Freddy Rumsen — Home Run, Ballerina guy. There have been a number of comments that indicate Freddy drinks too much even for that time.
flyme2themoon.
Are you thinking about the comment in the pilot? Don says to Pete he doesn't want to wake up pregnant in reference to Pete's pushiness. This is before Pete and Peggy had ever done the deed.
Just saw the preview for next week! Something bad is going to happen Pete. It shows him going into Don's office, looking rather stunned and disoriented. It seems like he is coming to get solace or something. Don blows him off (He really can be cold too sometimes. I mean Pete really does look up to him.) Maybe Pete found out about the baby?
I love spoilers. Ms. Darkley (love the name) e-mail me. Ellelque@msn.com
Since the actor who played Pete's father passed away in real life, I wonder if Pete finds out that his father died (of natural causes or not)?
That would explain it. Don is as close to a father figure to Pete as his own dad. They both criticize the hell out of him. Maybe Pete spends all his time trying to get the respect of Don and his dad?
OH, and Paul stole a typewriter from the office and someone else got the blame. That was kinda crappy move.
I hope that's not too spoilery, I think the actor's passing was mentioned here before.
Jackie, I think it's fine — the actor passing away is a fact and the rest is speculation.
Ms Darkly, you may be right, maybe it was a preview from last year (about Don and Pete and waking up pg), I know I saw it recently but it may have just been a "rerun" preview. I think they may just be jerking our chains with Pete's reacting to something "big" next week. I have a feeling Pete won't find out about his child until the end of this season, if ever. I thought I read that Peggy had kept the child and it was with her parents or a relative? Anyone else familiar with this? I read it in the last month or two. Thought I read that she was living with them too. They haven't shown us her living conditions at all yet, just a little clip of her getting ready for work at a dressing table, no way to know where she is.
I sent the spoiler to Ellelque and realized that my spoiler doesn't negate some of the theories above — it could work together. Hmmm… I really have no idea.
My favorite “wow, things have changed” line from last night’s ep: “No one under 25 drinks coffee.”
Even my college-age kid (on her iMac, ignoring us) laughed at that.
Anyone here remember that barren and lonely world — before Starbucks arrived, and saved us?
There's a Judy Campbell (the actress looks like she was hired to play Pete's sister) in the IMDB cast list for this episode and the next one, but I didn't see her in "For Those Who Think Young", so maybe she got cut out?
I'm thinking if Pete's family is around, then my theory might be correct with or without the spoiler being a factor.
I wholly agree with Interested Observer at 3:46. Another favorite scene was Pete finishing the box of chocolates with Trudy no where in sight. Aren't they the two who should be "celebrating" Valentine's Day?
And did anyone actually say “blah, blah, blah†in '62. It's way before my time, but I doubt it.
Fantastic Blog and wonderful comments! Thanks!
Oh juicy comments! Thanks everyone. I agree with some folks, that the episode wasn't cohesive in the way most of the previous season eps did. However, I have high hopes for the future…
Ah Betty – her entire demeanor has changed, hasn't it? I do feel that last season's Betty might have thought the line 'I wish you would tell me what to do' to Don in bed, but never would have been able to actually articulate it the way she did last night.
I did get a bit tingly in the scene at the Savoy when Betty comes down the stairs, in slo-mo, as Don watches. It seems that the two of them have reached some sort of accord for the moment. Great dress as well.
I find it fascinating that Betty could have easily been raped if things with the Esso man went just a bit differently – I'm intrigued as to where Betty's arc is going to go this season.
Fantastic blog as always! And Mazel tov on getting your question answered by Matt, Roberta!
I mean, Jackie smoked like a chimney, not my mother (my mother would be appalled, ha!)
With this show, I think character, not TV.
In TV land, a guy finds out he’s the father of a child a couple of episodes after the child is born. But on Mad Men, you have to think about how far Peggy would go to conceal that information — not to mention the fact she’d had a child in the first place.
So while there might be an event in the lives of these characters (Mrs. Kennedy showing viewers around the White House, a film, a real-world crisis), I don’t think you’ll see much evidence of them doing extreme things around one another.
That’s network-TV stuff: the twist, the shock, the big reaction.
Also, consider the time. Certain things persisted that no longer exist: the all-volunteer army, cocktail hour, some idea of when and where to wear one’s hat. There were still rules. People would not have broken them so casually.
A screenwriter in the 1970′s said of the culture that succeeded this one, “It was fun watching the applecart being upset. But now where do we go for apples?”
In 1962, they still had apples …
#28 Jackie: "What the? Is your tongue soft too, Don? Get to work!"
OMG we all (my MM dinner party for eight) have voted it best line of the episode!
A few random thoughts:
- Salvadore does great decorating. Love the wallpaper! And the "wife" is styling.
- Interesting reference about Gertie (the horse riding instructor) having a "crush" on Betty. Perhaps Betty will have Gertie express a romantic interest much like Joan Holloway's roommate did.
- Duck is Don's boomerang karma for treating Pete badly. The main reason Don hired Duck was to spite Pete for finding out that Don is [a] Dick. Now Duck [which is to my way of thinking rhyming with F**uck as far as Don's life is concerned] is giving Don grief for not listening to Pete's ideas. It's payback time baby!
- On the topic of boomerang karma, well I'd say there are some very interesting equations:
HOT WIFE + SOFT DICK = WIFE LOOKS ELSEWHERE
HAS A BABY + NO BABY = WHO'S YOUR DADDY
HATES DAD + NEEDS DAD + LOSES DAD = DON GET TRANSFERRED
#28 Jackie: "What the? Is your tongue soft too, Don? Get to work!"
OMG we all (my MM dinner party for eight) have voted it best line of the episode!
A few random thoughts:
- Salvadore does great decorating. Love the wallpaper! And the "wife" is styling.
- Interesting reference about Gertie (the horse riding instructor) having a "crush" on Betty. Perhaps Betty will have Gertie express a romantic interest much like Joan Holloway's roommate did.
- Duck is Don's boomerang karma for treating Pete badly. The main reason Don hired Duck was to spite Pete for finding out that Don is [a] Dick. Now Duck [which is to my way of thinking rhyming with F**uck as far as Don's life is concerned] is giving Don grief for not listening to Pete's ideas. It's payback time baby!
- On the topic of boomerang karma, well I'd say there are some very interesting equations:
Don and Betty:
HOT WIFE + SOFT DICK = WIFE LOOKS ELSEWHERE
Peggy, Pete, Don:
HAS A BABY + NO BABY = WHO'S YOUR DADDY
Pete and Don:
HATES DAD + NEEDS DAD + LOSES DAD = PETE DOES DON TRANSFERENCE
Everybody's Life in General:
ONE BIG HUNKING XEROX COPY MACHINE = KARMA MACHINE
#152 – 1962 was not before my time (I was 13) and "blah, blah, blah" was absolutely in common usage. Actually I think it was in general usage for really a long time before that. Now if he had said, "yada, yada, yada…" that would be an anachronism. Seinfeld didn't invent everything!
New here, but I love this site!
*Like popular old movies are re-released on DVD today, Gone With the Wind was re-released in '47 (When a teenaged Betty could've seen it), '54, and '61, when Sally could've seen it.
* Does anyone think it is just like Betty to put Sally in Ballet, an activity where girls strive to be thin and pretty?
*I love the fact that Peggy is coming into her own, pitching her own "Welcome back, Daddy" ad and deciding that acne cream should be directed at 6th graders.
*Pete and Trudy won't last if they can't have a baby. Trudy has everything and is obsessed with a baby, and if she can't have one, she'll blame Pete. Pete is not one to take blame, and while he didn't seem to one a child that much, if everyone else can have one, like Harry Crane, he'll want one, too.
Okay. Since I've already been outed as having a ring fetish, did anyone notice that Betty wore her wedding and engagement rings on her "right" hand when she and Don were in bed at the hotel? In every other scene, including the one just prior to that when she emerged from the bathroom, the rings were on her left hand. I can't imagine that Matthew Weiner would allow that sort of slip up, so I have to conclude it was intentional.
Was this her version of a Madonna/Whore game? Did she think Don would be more responsive to her if she pretended not to be his wife? Did it make her appear to be more loose and adventurous? Was she pretending to be one of his mistresses…or a "party girl"? That also suggests to me that Don's impotence has been an ongoing problem, and not something brought about by his health and medication.
I'm curious to hear everyone's theories. I know you all taped it, so go back and re-watch, and tell me what you think.
I think there is something about a couple getting a room that speaks of hot sex. The kids aren't in the next room, there is no housework to be done, and it's time to let the good times roll.
Part of the allure, for both people, could be how well it lends to roleplaying. This could be someone you picked up at the hotel bar. I think Betty's outfit lends to the fantasy although my friend, the fan of stockings, says they overplayed the reaction to what should be a variation on her normal underthings. Basically, the lingering camera was more for us than Don, although I think she'd stepped it up a notch or three anyhow.
Maybe Betty really was wanting to give him what she imagined the other women had provided.
Only she didn't know to bring the brunette wig.
LOL, Ms. D. That's because in Betty's mind, blondes represent the pinnacle of beauty. I don't think she could even comprehend that some men prefer darker women–just as she couldn't fathom that "some men like eyebrows,"
**my friend, the fan of stockings, says they overplayed the reaction to what should be a variation on her normal underthings. **
But is that really a variation on her normal underthings? We saw Betty last season in her normal underthings, and they were pretty chaste. Slip, white, bullet bra, white, and matching (presumably) girdle/garter and panties (also white, I bet). Even her negligees were kind of prim. I doubt she'd have let that traveling salesman in her house or stood out in the yard shooting pigeons in that lacy black number–even if she were completely bonkers. But she had no problem doing those things in her "normal" lingerie.
You have a point — I think he was just saying that foundation garments were usually worn under clothing and stockings with garters were still the norm, so, while very sexy, it wouldn't have the same bang as if most of us appeared like that at bedtime.
I think your point is excellent in that Betty liked to rock it more virginal, but she was never wearing Hanes Her Way and one of Don's old wife beaters — not that that's not a look, too.
"it wouldn’t have the same bang as if most of us appeared like that at bedtime"
It certainly would have a different impact if I appeared like that at bedtime, let me tell you!
If I appeared like that at bedtime and there wasn’t a bang…!
Must. Have. Bang!
Almost all I can think about is smoking. I don't wish to smoke and if perhaps someone offered me a smoke right now, I will not accept. I feel I'm in a very horrible mental condition and have had trouble falling asleep yet I do know I ought to end up resilient and strong. The ecig may help me out in the long run.